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1944 no1 mk3*

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dthiede View Drop Down
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    Posted: August 03 2010 at 4:24am
Hello,
 I'm new to the forum and I recently bought a 1944 enfield no1 mk3* rifle. It doesn't have any manufacturer name on the right side butt socket. It has a crown, under that is a "B" and under that is "1944". There is a faint "FTR" under that. I have included a few pictures hoping someone could tell me more about it. Thanks in advance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cookie Monster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2010 at 4:47am
That year in a No1 MkIII is going to be a Lithgow, Is there a MA anywhere? And that is a very good looking rifle. Welcome to the Forum !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dthiede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2010 at 5:12am
Thanks for the comments. There is no MA anywhere on it. I have seen Lithgow rifles and this one doesn't have the same butt socket markings. I also forgot that there is a "GR" under the crown and the "B" is under that. I will try to get a good pic of the butt socket.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LE Owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2010 at 5:54am
I've seen a few with sparse and not well stamped markings.
The sockets looked like an original makers name had been ground away.
These had mid 40's dates but the actions and some parts looked to be WW1 manufacture.
 
Not sure but these may have been rifles put together from stockpiled parts by BSA during the war.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2010 at 8:54am
those would be BSA dispersal rifles , these were simply marked with a "B" , this could well be one of those , BSA produced mkIII* from 1915-1944 , serial number prefix in 43-44 would be "N" , they made 60000 in 42-44 , the FTR could throw things off a little but i think its a BSA 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dthiede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2010 at 9:46pm
Here is the best pic I could get of the butt socket. The serial prefix on all the numbered parts is an "S" and all numbers match including the forestock. If it is a dispersal rifle, how common are they today? The reason I ask is while the rifle is in really nice condition, the barrel is badly worn and the bullets tumble. I've tried several different types of ammo all with the same result. I'm thinking of having it rebarrelled but I don't want to ruin an uncommon or desirable rifle.


Thank you for your help

Dan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ArcherSix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2010 at 4:57am
My #1 is a BSA dispersal rifle. Don't know how uncommon they are, but mine has the BSA marking on the socket and the stacked rifles mark on the knox form.
Cool rifle and welcome. Maybe you could get her to shoot with reloads? Have you slugged the bore?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dthiede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2010 at 5:22am
I have slugged the bore. A .307 dia gage pin will go thru the bore. The muzzle will accept a .308 pin about 1/4 inch. Its difficult to tell how far it goes into the chamber end but I would guess about 1/4 inch also. The groove dia is .317 from the chamber thru at least half way up the barrel and .320 about 1 inch into the muzzle. I have not seen any bullet molds that cast a .317 dia bullet. I welcome any ideas.

Dan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LE Owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2010 at 11:18am
Originally posted by dthiede dthiede wrote:

I have slugged the bore. A .307 dia gage pin will go thru the bore. The muzzle will accept a .308 pin about 1/4 inch. Its difficult to tell how far it goes into the chamber end but I would guess about 1/4 inch also. The groove dia is .317 from the chamber thru at least half way up the barrel and .320 about 1 inch into the muzzle. I have not seen any bullet molds that cast a .317 dia bullet. I welcome any ideas.

Dan
Alot of the Enfield owners that visit the Cast Boolits forums have bores that run far oversized.
I haven't had that problem with my SMLE, which has the tightest bore of any I've seen yet.
They say its best to use a bullet the same size as the thoat, so long as theres enough clearance in the chamber neck when the bullet is seated in the case neck.
 
The original SMLE MkI bores were reverse taper lapped for around 14 inches from the muzzle, and max bore at the muzzle for these ran around .32+.
The taper lapping usually resulted in a sort of belled muzzle.
These were meant for use with the MkVI heavy bullet at around 2,000+ FPS.
The Cordite Mk1 charge of those cartridges bumped the bullets up much more than most modern powders could be expected to.
The reverse taper was intended to relieve friction on the bullet so velocity would remain the same as from the longer Lee Enfield barrels.
Replacement barrels for the SMLE MkI were approved arond 1917, the replacements were not reverse taper lapped and were likely upgraded to the SC HV (short cone high velocity) for the Mark VII ammunition.
 
It could be that an unused SMLE MkI pre 1917 barrel somehow ended up in the parts bin when this rifle was put together.
 
It would appear that these rifles were not intended as frontline issue, more likely for training and guard use, or perhaps to supply allied resistence or native troops.
 
Yours is a good looking rifle, hope it shoots okay.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dthiede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2010 at 11:05pm
Thanks for the comments. This is my first Enfield and I'm trying to learn as much about it as I can. I'll check out the cast boolits site and see what I can do.

Thanks again
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