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(BOUGHT IT) a 1914 BSA SMLE ftr'd in 44*

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Shamu View Drop Down
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    Posted: July 30 2017 at 1:52pm
OK, guys & girls, help me out here I'm not really a SMLE expert but I just may have found something so I'd like your opinions on it, its value & a few questions.


I have a chance to get this rifle, sorry for the image quality it was very limited opportunity & I had to do this on the fly.

What I think I know”:

Its a 1914 BSA made No1 MkIII*.

BUT its marked as a MkIII no star, but it has the sights without windage, no magazine cut off, nor is there a slot for one.

Serial No is a 4 digit 924X Numbers match on bolt handle, barrel receiver ring nose cap & magazine. There is also another number on the magazine which has been over-struck but might have been50699?


It was FTR'd somewhere in '44* (I think because that's the barrel date).

The sight has the S/A “arrow in a “U” property mark, but nothing else does.

The bolt head is stamped with just a “U”


Markings from back to front.


Rear left of receiver by bolt raceway:

99 (or88) poorly struck

AR


Right side:

15

KS

0 (or0, or C)


Receiver ring right side:

crown

G.R.

BSA Co

1914

ShtLE

III (there may be a very faint “dot” or period very low down, Maybe a sloppily mis-struck “*”?


Right side receiver raceway up high adjacent to bolt release cut:

NO1MK III K

Directly below that

CAI St Alb Vt


front receiver ring:

F

924X (serial number)


WD arrow.


Other stuff:

the front sling swivel band is the split/hinged type.


The peep sight is a PH 5a, but is oddly mounted.

It looks like they just used the standard rear trigger guard screws first 2 or 3 turns.

The “figure-8 spring" on the safety is missing but there's a coil spring between the bracket & safety that's performing the function well enough. But the bracket seems canted both vertically & diagonally.


What can you tell me?

Thanks.

Pics:






*edited, sorry I mis-remembered the barrel date it was '44, not '42.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote englishman_ca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2017 at 2:58pm
The coil spring for the safety is supposed to be there to work with the sight, no dumb bell used.

Looks to be a nice old rifle that somebody fitted a target sight (well, almost fitted). I think that this is likely to be the work of a previous civilian owner. If it isn/t sitting right, something has been messed with. It can be fixed.

The sight if in nice condition is probably worth almost as much as the rifle.

A target rifle it is not, but could have potential to shoot well. I am biased, I love these old rifles. I love shooting them.

1914 is not a common date to find, so that adds to collector interest. It has the 'been there' look. It has taken (and no doubt, given) a Schmidt kicking or two.

No mag cut off slot is intriguing. Kinda early for mk.III* manufacturing concessions. But the List of Changes being published made things official, there was often a lag time to get the paperwork up to date. 
The definitive changes to Mk.III* status was to do with the sighting. Deletion of mag cut off and other concessions were subsequent to that and optional. 

If the price is right. But I have no idea. My guess would be way off. I am usually off by about ten years in value.
Basic working man surplus Smellies are now collector's items. This is a nice one with character. Now next to consider is working condition. If something doesnt have a bright bore in the barrel, I usually pass or look at it as donor and haggle accordingly.

'Dark bore with lots of rifling visible' or 'frosted bore' means to me that the rifle has seen neglect and not maintained and cleaned after shooting. Period. A good bore is my litmus test.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2017 at 3:44pm
Is that crack in the stock serious?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2017 at 5:51pm
The bore is fine, clear with sharp rifling &very little fouling.

The big crack is in the rear handguard, the "fingers" are missing also, both common faults, but easily fixable with a "new" rear handguard.

It seems I need either the figure 8 & go back to the original sights, or  the correct rear trigger guard screw & keep the PH5. Or both & pick what my mood saysOuch
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2017 at 6:08pm
Shamu, I have several proper rear trigger guard screws for the #1/MK3 rifles if you are ever in need.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote englishman_ca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2017 at 6:53pm
You will need a longer rear trigger guard screw to mount the sight.

The longer long Lee rear trigger guard screw is just the about right length.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2017 at 6:55pm
Oh I see, point taken.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stanforth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 2:46am
Originally posted by Shamu Shamu wrote:



The big crack is in the rear handguard, the "fingers" are missing also, both common faults, but easily fixable with a "new" rear handguard.


Take the handguard off. Press it together and if it fits together nicely, Stick it with superglue and bind it tight with sticky tape until it sets.
That way you keep the original guard and it will be a colour/patina match to the rest of the gun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stanforth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 2:53am
I also noticed that it has a slab sided cocking piece.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 5:27am
Originally posted by englishman_ca englishman_ca wrote:

You will need a longer rear trigger guard screw to mount the sight.

The longer long Lee rear trigger guard screw is just the about right length.

Thanks for the tip, is it the same thread & is the head workable with this bracket?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pukka Bundook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 5:33am
It's a nice rifle Shamu.
Could do with a length of threaded brass wire for the rear handguard.
The flat cocking piece maybe wound up there in the FTR.  As long as it fit they weren't fussy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote englishman_ca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 5:34am
Yes, the screw is same thread and has a larger cheese head, it works well.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 8:12am
Sweet, thanks.
I got it, just brought it home today.
Popped the rear handguard & its completely split, but will go back together with pressure. All the wood is saturated with linseed, it was sweating it just in the back of the van with the a/c on coming home!
I swabbed the mating surfaces with denatured a few times to degrease it & have it bound with tape & filled with gorilla glue. If it works, great! If not I'll get a replacement with the fingers also. I may try the wood spliced "Biscuits" like the original just for the experience as well.
It has a few boogered screw heads so I'm going to replace them, detail strip & clean all the oozing cosmo & buff it (no abrasives! there are nice markings still in the stock so I don't want to over restore it, just de-butcher the messed up parts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote paddyofurniture Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 9:47am
gorilla glue is great stuff!

I use it for all my stock repairs.

Remember to wipe any extra once you clap the bits up in place.

Tooth pick work great for this job.

My only questions on gorilla glue is it made by gorillas or from gorillas?

Just do not get it on your hand and them go take a leak.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 10:16am
I've been using plain old carpenter's white glue, like Elmers glue. It works well but the curing time might be longer than Gorilla glue.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2017 at 10:43am
I'm gonna put "Gorilla Glue" on Paddy's T.P. when I go to visit.
That oughta be interesting..
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