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No.4 Mk1 (T?) Updated!!!

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thouston View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2010 at 12:48pm
Update:
Today my quest was to find a gunsmith that was capable and knowledgeable enough with the enfields to do a front pad removal and install... along with other things. So I strolled into my local shop, just to check it out... maybe find a good deal on some surplus .303 if nothing else.

Well, I happened to run into a man that was plenty willing to help.... another owner of many enfields and a retired smith here. He doesn't do much work these days, but once he had seen the rifle a conversation struck up and low and behold... I've got a helper, so it's all good!

Stay tuned for another update.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beerhunter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2010 at 11:31pm
Originally posted by thouston thouston wrote:

Barrel markings:

303 " 2.22 '''

1 & (ordinance mark) + TONS (S or C, the bottom part of it is stamped too light to tell)

Top of front sight blade stamped with S +.045



Not an Ordnance mark but an English Proof Mark.    Looks Like London to me. The rest should read: 18.5 TONS [] " .  It means that it has been though civilian ownership in the UK.

The foresight was made by Savage and its tip is .045 inch greater than (although the blade is not taller) than one inch above the centre line of the barrel.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote madcratebuilder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 26 2010 at 1:00am
From what I have read the Savage-Stevens rifles that went to Holland&Holland were the MkI* variant and were never fitted with scopes, pads only.  Is their anything published that is different?
From my cold dead hands
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thouston View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 26 2010 at 1:58pm
To be honest, I'm not on the up and up regarding the MkI* (star) being the only mark of that rifle to be converted by H&H into sniper configuration, but again I'm no expert.

As far as published stuff goes, I've read enough to know that in the Enfield period 1942 and up world... 
seems like anything went. 

If you figure a lowly production standpoint of lets say... 
30K rifles a year, produced.
15K fielded, and many of which were brought back for repairs.... etc.
15K held in armory, some of the above could have been.

You get 60 thousand, half of which where fielded and the other half dedicated to advancement and repairs.
If the war production ended in 2 years, that is 120 thousand rifles... floating around.

I don't know much, but I'll say that is "alot"of MK4 rifles that could be in and out of circulation.
Furthermore, who knows what happened to them... once they were sold of in surplus?

All I know is: I have what I have, and it's damn interesting from what I've read.


I'll be working with the smith in a day or three... so bear with me on this.

Regards,
T-


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thouston View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 05 2010 at 8:58am
Got her back today!
I can't say enough good things about the smith, the guy rocks!
Unfortunately, I didn't get any pics of the process... but it went something like this:

Clamped on a couple finned heatsinks, and fired up a small butane torch... working the flame around the pad, and she came right off... Big smile
After we cleaned the receiver up, we test fitted the new pad... here we had to do a little work to get it lined up correctly with the mount, bore and receiver. Apparently, it was 'pretty close' at first he said. Took about an hours worth from there.. as he had to mill a few thousandths from the back of the pad itself for 'perfect fit'. Soldered the new one on, and good to go.

Here she is:
Front pad on!

An idea of what it will look like scoped...
(pay no attention to that old bushnell 3x9 sharpshooter.... just something I threw on there when I got it back home.)


One more pic:



Now the search is on for some goodies to finish it off... and some better glass!
I'm sure I'll be kicking around the classifieds here, there are a few things I'll need to pick up.

When I've got some downtime, I'll try to get her out to see how she shoots. When I get enough rounds to do a good day pseudo range test, I'll do an update here.

Rock on!


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MJ11 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MJ11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2010 at 12:12am
More scope!
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kysusha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2010 at 8:27am

One option of fixing a dented piece of woodwork is to use heat and water.

I’d take to the woodwork with steel wool first, remove all the dirt, stickiness, yuck and gung and grime over the years. Do the whole stock like that so that it is thoroughly, informally cleaned.  I usually use some saddle soap and warm water as the medium.

 

Then get a damp woollen cloth and place it over the bruise on the woodwork and place over that a very hot iron.  This has the action of swelling the fibres of the wood and thus expanding them and reducing or removing the bruise. You may have to repeat the process several times. On completion, clean off again with steel wool. (You may very lightly sand off with 600 wet and dry paper).

 

Leave the stock in a naturally ventilated space to surface dry (you won’t have “soaked” the stock!”).

 

I then apply Danish Oil (love the stuff – some guys I know use boiled Linseed oil, but…) and later a good application of neutral shoe polish (wax).

 

This leaves the stock in a light, oiled mode, well protected and looking good.    

Evil is when good men do nothing about it.
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thouston View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2010 at 12:03pm
Kysusha:
I'd heard of the damp cloth and iron trick... I'll look into that!
Any recommendation for the steel wool? I've got plenty of different grades here that I can chose from.
00/000 maybe? I've even got some Danish Oil here....  

She does need a good cleaning. Stock is definitely got some funk to it.

MJ11:
What scope is that? 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kysusha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2010 at 9:51am

I’m a heathen with the steel wool – I simply use the wife’s dishwashing pads. Simply scrubbing harder if I want to lift more off and going lighter when I’m finishing.  Wear rubber gloves and have the water as hot as you can stand it while removing the grunge off your stock.

 

Make sure the stock has dried out before applying the Danish Oil, then let that well and truly dry before waxing. The wax gives a nice finish and it also give a very nice feel – almost a non-slip feel to the woodwork; very handy in the rain.

Evil is when good men do nothing about it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MJ11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2010 at 11:57am
Leupold M3 LR
 
I have two Savage rifle from H&H and they are all MkI or MkI* and one MkI* receiver that will end up a .308.
 
I like them and they will out shoot the UK guns depending on which one I test against. They are well made rifles.
 
I want to hear how the new front pad  works out. I have one rifle with a loose front pad.
 
Cheers
.....MJ.....
 
 
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Kysusha View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kysusha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2010 at 12:52pm
I'm curious - those are No4 mk1 * rifles but haven't they got incorrect bolt-heads on them?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MJ11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2010 at 10:55pm
I'm curious - those are No4 mk1 * rifles but haven't they got incorrect bolt-heads on them?
 
........................?..........................
 
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Kysusha View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kysusha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2010 at 6:23am

Awh come on, now you’re just making me jealous! Don’t like breaking the 10th Commandment!

 

Very nice selection of (T)’s.

 

However, back to my comment – isn’t the round bolt head the incorrect bolt-head for the No.4?

 

Now for a new question – where do you get the ‘scope covers from – I’m missing mine?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lithgow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2010 at 7:26am
I think you are referring to the cocking peice when you say that the bolt head is incorrect.
The early No4's had a round cocking peice. The bolt head is on the other end of the bolt.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LE Owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2010 at 7:35am
Originally posted by Kysusha Kysusha wrote:

Awh come on, now you’re just making me jealous! Don’t like breaking the 10th Commandment!

 

Very nice selection of (T)’s.

 

However, back to my comment – isn’t the round bolt head the incorrect bolt-head for the No.4?

 

Now for a new question – where do you get the ‘scope covers from – I’m missing mine?

Don't you mean the round button cocking piece rather than bolthead?
 
I noticed one of the Savages had a fore end cut for the magazine cutt off plate.
 
First I heard of Savage manufacture No.4 T rifles was a shooting test done with a converted Trials rifle which had the cut off plate and Six groove bore. I may have the magazine with this test and photo spread around here somewhere.
 
There were a number of stories around concerning the six groove barrels. Some said they were rifled blanks from a French military contract, others that they were rifled on machinery aready set up for a commercial contract. The twist rate may be other than 1:10.
I think more is known about the Smith Corona six groove Springfield barrels, also of Savage origin , than the Savage No.4 six groove.
Also the late production Long Branch six groove is another animal entirely, these are said to have a right hand twist.
A right hand twist would serve to offset lateral throw to the left of the Enfield action by means of spin drift effects, the two should very nearly cancel each other out. I wonder if any studies on this have been done.
 
 
PS
While I'd much prefer the earlier action body with the bolt release catch, I hear that the later type with rail cut out is prefered for the 7.62 conversions. The milled out slot for the bolt catch is said to weaken the receiver at that point enough to have caused some rifles to fail proof.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kysusha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2010 at 12:14pm

I understand that quite a few rifles developed a fault with the cut-out in that the bolt catch would “jump out” on fast cocking action and I have witnessed a couple of actions BEF [beyond economic repair], caused by the burring of the bolt catch and the cut-out.

 

This was remedied with the Mk2, as I understand.

 
PS - Yes, Round Button Cocking Piece!
Evil is when good men do nothing about it.
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