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Hornady 174gr BTHP for hunting?

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Rolltide386 View Drop Down
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    Posted: February 26 2015 at 3:34pm
I went into my local army surplus store today and they had two boxes of these in stock. He said he had them for a year or so, that hardly anyone comes in looking for .303 and when they do they will by the PPU fmj for cheaper. So my question is would these be a good hunting round for whitetail, and has anyone shot these before?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 5:22pm
More of a match round than a hunting round Rolltide386. Others here may expand on this and I have zero experience with this ammunition. Likely very tough to find any more of this I would think?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rolltide386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 5:26pm
Originally posted by Canuck Canuck wrote:

More of a match round than a hunting round Rolltide386. Others here may expand on this and I have zero experience with this ammunition. Likely very tough to find any more of this I would think?
He said he's had it awhile. Not many people come in looking for 303 ammo and when they do, they buythe cheaper ammo. He has a few boxes and didnt know if it would be worth the money.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 5:55pm
I don't get Hornady in my neck o the woods. NEVER get 174 gr, either (If I found it - I would snap it up!)
Some rifles don't like "boat-tails", but as for white tail, I'd use it.
I normally only have a choice twixt 150 or 180 grn.
I use 150 exclusively on white tail,80 for the moose.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rolltide386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 5:58pm
Originally posted by hoadie hoadie wrote:

I don't get Hornady in my neck o the woods. NEVER get 174 gr, either (If I found it - I would snap it up!)
Some rifles don't like "boat-tails", but as for white tail, I'd use it.
I normally only have a choice twixt 150 or 180 grn.
I use 150 exclusively on white tail,80 for the moose.
Hoadie
He's got them priced for $29.99 . I figured that's a good price.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 6:00pm
Buy all you can carry!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rolltide386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 6:02pm
Originally posted by hoadie hoadie wrote:

Buy all you can carry!
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Haha he's only got two boxes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 6:16pm
If you re-load ammo this brass should be good to go.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rolltide386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 26 2015 at 6:19pm
Originally posted by Canuck Canuck wrote:

If you re-load ammo this brass should be good to go.
I don't at the moment but I'm going to. Any experiance with this round ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2015 at 5:19am
Its a duplicate of the MKVII, probably intended for target shooters to match the sights calibrated for MIlSurp originals.
I'd think they were at best an "iffy" hunting round, except for something where deep penetration would be required, like Elephant or rhino..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pukka Bundook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2015 at 5:45am
This isn't hunting ammo David.

It's supposed to be match ammunition.
It does have a hollow point, but is made for target work.
For hunting you want a soft point really, and would be better off choosing one of the soft point options.
A while back a Bronze point was available, and these at first glance appeared to be full jacket.
They did expand well though.
Whether these loaded by Hornady are a thick jacket or not I do not know, so can't say how they would perform on game.
With the hollow point, they may not penetrate all that well on heavy stuff, but may zing right through a deer without opening up.

For hunting, find a hunting bullet.Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rolltide386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2015 at 5:55am
Thank yall very much for your answers. I was thrown off by it being a hollow point.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2015 at 7:54am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rolltide386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2015 at 7:59am
Originally posted by Shamu Shamu wrote:

I'm betting its a Sierra MatchKing load.
I wouldnt be interested in it unless it is a hunting round, which has been explained its not. I can get PPU's all day long from the same place for much cheaper for plinking rounds.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tony Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 28 2015 at 1:17am
You need the controlled expansion of a soft point to ensure a clean kill. I use 150grn sierras for the 303 and the 308s and the Dragunov all have excellent stopping power and cause minimum meat damage.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DairyFarmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 28 2015 at 4:54am
Originally posted by Tony Tony wrote:

You need the controlled expansion of a soft point to ensure a clean kill.
That is a myth and I'll explain.
 
Expansion, and the control of it, has 2 functions. Firstly it increases the diameter on the bullet. This increases the wound channel and surrounding ballistic shock, increasing the damage done to muscle and organs, and potentially more meat damage. Secondly, by using an expanding round, you are wanting to limit penetration. This stops the bullet as it passes through the vitals and avoids exiting the animal and wounding another.
 
The most important factors are getting the bullet to the target with enough energy and energy retention and having the bullet perform as expected.
 
But a lot more has to do with the animal, the result and the conditions.
 
Thick skinned animals (i,e, elephant) require the bullet to penetrate through a thick hide. But the result is to put the animal down with no regard to the quantity of meat damage. The condition would most likely be a frontal head shot at about 20 meters and almost zero chance of over penetration and hitting another target. So a big, heavy solid is what you want.
 
But you wouldn't be using a 303 (ethically and legally anyway).
 
So lets look at a soft skinned animal. Almost every medium to large deer/antelope can be ethically hunted using anything from 6mm up. But now the animal/result/condition changes. The animal is negligible here. The result is either a trophy first or meat first. If it is meat a head, upper neck or frontal chest shot would be ideal. A well placed head shot by a competent marksman can take a kudu/moose with a .222 or .223 using a mono or fmj. But you have to remember the condition. Are you likely to hit another animal? Will the bullet perform as intended at the range you are shooting?
 
The top of the neck shot (where the neck and skull meet, and my personal favourite shot) can be accomplished with all but varmint bullets. It is generally a 2" or bigger target with a 99% kill or 10 miss. In other words you either miss completely or the animal is down and out.
 
The frontal chest shot has little in the way of error too. A shallow penetration would most certainly hit the "engine room". On the other hand a deep penetration would do a lot of damage to the vitals.
 
Finally the "safety" shot. As the animal places its front leg forward aim for where the "elbow" was at mid stride. Again either a shallow penetration or deep penetration will put the animal down and out.
 
Very seldom, as a meat hunter, would you use a raking shot or, the worst meat damager of all, the Texas Heart Shot, or going away shot. These shots are bet left to trophy hunters or those unlucky enough to have a runner. In that latter case you are placing shots ethically as opposed to hunting for meat.
 
Now if you are hunting close range, no matter the bullet, if you have a very fast round you will damage meat. Generally speaking you want a heavy, slow round that hits its target and maintains its energy as it penetrates the animal.
 
So this is my long way round of saying that expansion as less to do with a clean kill and meat damage, that all the other factors that have lead to the shot being taken. The rifle, the hunter, the environment, the animal, the result, and so on.
 
I'm not sucking this stuff out of my thumb either. During my stint as a PH, over a period of 3 years I guided hunters in the harvesting of over 400 Common Reedbuck. These were shot, on foot during daylight, at ranges from 30 meters to 300 meters using everything from .223 to .375H&H, 50gr to 300gr. Taking the hunter, rifle and environment into account, I had 0% lost animals. Only a few (less than 5%) required follow up shots and only 2 required me to complete the job (.375H&H open sights with 300gr Barnes X).
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