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Need help identifying my No4 Mk1 Enfield

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killerken924 View Drop Down
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    Posted: May 30 2018 at 3:56pm
Just picked up a sporterized NO4 Mk1 enfield today for 100 bucks, barrel is shiny.
I am going to get the stock pieces i need and make it as original as can be.
But i'm really new to enfields and i don't understand any of the markings.
I was hoping someone could help learn more about it.
It has a button to remove the bolt and its serial is 15833 with an AB above it.
Here are some pictures,

This is the serial once i loosen the stock and bring it down a bit, its a lot more clear than the others.

Here is where it says its a No.4 Mk1 but it has some odd stamps too.

Here is the other serials, it is as bad is it looks, i can tell the date is 1942 and the serials is 15833 along with the AB, there is also a 52 up on the top right, no idea what that is... 

There is a f marked on the sight

Here is picture of the sight

And a unit marking maybe? On the butt stock

And the final one with markings, its not a great picture but there is a weird animal looking N thing on the top and a N on the very bottom, and maybe there was something in between? 

And here is just a picture of the side, the reason im also posting this is because i don't know what type of wood it is and what type i should get when i replace the whole front?

Thanks in advance, my phones camera is pretty crappy, its the best i have.
What type of wood stock would be accurate and somewhat match with the butstock,
and is there a way to tell what kinda of handguard this had(meaning grooved or ungrooved)?
Anything i need to worry about with this type of enfield?
Any help would be appreciated, thanks in advance.



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kiwibob View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kiwibob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2018 at 2:46am
he!!o. I'm new here as well. But can offer some information that I have picked up. This is a #4 MK1 action you have, I think circa -1942 - (F) you see means that bit with the (F) on it was made at one of the Royal Ordinance Factory's located in Fazackery-Liverpool,England. Its important that serial numbers on barrel, bolt and action all match (hard to tell until disassembly)and that the barrel has not been cut down or the front sight modified, or receiver - drilled and tapped for scope, before considering a refit. other wise, waiting to find one that has all the wood and the right serial numbers would be a better option. There were many thousands of these made and the nomenclature is slightly arcane, but there is plenty of information already available on the net, if you are willing to do the research.

I do like this particular action myself, over other iteration's of it because it is, in my view the best design, also the button for bolt removal was later dropped, to speed production, and replaced with a cutaway near the chamber to facilitate bolt head derail and removal. A bad move in my opinion.

(that's just my view though and not particularly shared)


Another thing would be to check condition inside the barrel.
Again - there is a mountain of information available on this on the net.

Since you are basically starting from ($100) scratch.

You may as well start with a good barrel.

.
.


The hardest part is finding good replacement wood - pretty much all exhausted were I am.

Looks like your stock is walnut, there was also other woods used, beech whatever suited at the time - Walnut being preferred.

If you can get hold of a #4 set of wood for this, then I envy your circumstances.

Nothing at all to be worried about with this though, as far as old bolt actions go, you probably could not find a less worrying one if you tried to.


I hope this helps some - others on here, have a wealth of experience and knowledge, and will be able to add a lot of info.


Do yourself a favour, and do some research on the net though, because you will find a lot of your Q&A is already there. Plus tons more.

enjoy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2018 at 9:10pm
the serial number on the barrel makes it a maltby , our resident expert [collectoter of all data maltby - bear] may correct me but i think if the rest match - its that , i think 1942 if my data is correct , the 187 is a rack number from some use - cadet , or other , we need to know if the bolt , receiver , magazine , and rear sight match , they should all be numbered to the rifle if intact would be correct , 

while the F does make that rear sight a Faz item its not necessarily wrong - unless corrected here , that would not be unusual in after war refurb , i think it was replaced - but then its been sported so a lot might be replaced here , 

is the barrel intact - full length ? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote killerken924 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2018 at 4:07am
Yes the barrel is fully intact, i will look and take some pictures of the other parts to see if they match, thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote killerken924 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2018 at 4:19am
Thanks, the barrel is quite shiny and nice. 
I think i might be able to get a walnut stock set for around 150 us dollars around here
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2018 at 4:30am
Agree it's Maltby manufacture. Suspect the wood is walnut.
Please post a photo of the full length of the rifle, so we can see if the barrel is original length with bayonet lug's etc.
It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote killerken924 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2018 at 11:42pm
The gun is in its full length, measured around 44.5 inches.
Here is the picture up close to the front sight, you can see what i think is the bayonet lugs and front sight.

The bolt serial on the outside matches the barrel and the receiver, do i need to take the bolt apart to see any other numbers?
The magazine is missing.
Any other places i need to look for serial?
I'm trying to get my camera to focus on the whole gun, but its being kinda crappy and just won't.
But it does seem the only thing that was really sporterized was the front stock pieces and the sight guard was removed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bear43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2018 at 8:27am
Yep, it is a Maltby. Maltby serial numbers start with a 1 and the in the second picture, those circular inspection stamps are unique to Maltby. If it is okay I would like to save these pictures for my book project, with all credit to you, killerken924. If you want your actual name for the credits then please PM me. If you wouldn't mind humoring a request I would like to see a closeup picture of the circular inspection stamps on the left front of the receiver as well as a picture of the markings on the underside of the wrist where the trigger guard fits. That second part requires removal of the trigger guard which is quite easy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2018 at 9:52am
No need to dismantle anything the bolts number should be on the rear face of the bolt handle right next to the "crossed Seaxes" proof mark.
Friendly tip for you. Store it with the springs eased & the cocking piece forward.
Easy way to do it is open the bolt, pull & hold the trigger, close bolt!
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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saltytom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 12 2018 at 9:14pm
Hi
I am also trying to identify and get information about a rifle by its serial number. I have my fathers pay book from the 2nd WW in it he wrote his rifle number.
The number is S 9862. Any information would be really appreciated by my self and my son as we are researching my fathers war story.
Thanks Salty
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 12 2018 at 11:18pm
I suspect that serial number would be for an SMLE (Short Magazine Lee Enfield) No1 MkIII (*) and not the later No4 type as seen above.
However maybe someone with more expert knowledge could tell you the maker. If your Father was in the Australien army then Lithgow would be more likely; but not definitely as I believe they did also have UK made rifles.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 13 2018 at 6:14am
I agree, a single letter & 4 digit number sounds more SMLE than No4. If it was it would have looked like this:


This is a Brit-made one but if he served in Aus his might well have been made at Lithgow, the Aussie national small arms factory, near Sidney.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saltytom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 13 2018 at 7:11pm
Hi thanks for the reply‚Äôs   
My father served in the British army in Malta
and Italy. I thought maybe the serial number
identify the model and place of manufacture.
Is the another site for tracing that ?
Thanks again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 13 2018 at 7:58pm
not with those bayo lugs tho , but if we have moved on the the second rifle im thinking BSA if its 40s dated as that was all there was then , if older we have some options out there RSF enfield used the S in 17 & 18 , SSA in 16 , 17 & 18 , problem will be if the factory marks are gone or altered and if bits have been switched in its conversion , 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 14 2018 at 8:01am
Yeah, with the new pictures & information its definitely a No4 Mk1, it says so right on the receiver.The serial numbers recycled, starting with no prefix going up to 99999 then increment the letter & starting over. after Z99999 they added a second letter.
IIRC the first digit was a code for the manufacturer.
The white painted number looks like a "Rack Number" denoting where exactly it was stored.
Beyond that its hard to tell they really didn't record the various assignments individually.
It would have looked like this in full service configuration.



Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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