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No.4 Mk1 (T?) Updated!!!

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thouston View Drop Down
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    Posted: October 16 2009 at 6:10am

Here is my old Enfield No.4 Mk1.
My father bought this rifle many years ago, from an old man that claimed it was 'his weapon' in the war. Several years ago I inherited it, after sitting in a closet for nearly 15 years.

Here she is:


Upon some closer inspection, it appears that this rifle was a sniper model... and the old man we bought it from took the liberty of grinding off the eye on the front scope pad!Cry



Other than a few nicks here and there, (and the pad) it looks to be a pretty decent rifle with no signs of extreme wear. I remember when we brought it home, still covered in cosmoline. It took forever to get that crap off of there! 



Here are a few more pictures of it:







So, my questions are:
How would one go about finding a front pad for this?
I would like to keep it as original as I can, and I have thought about replacing the botched pad and possibly getting a scope mount for it. Is that wise or should I just leave well enough alone? 

And finally, what is she worth?
Thanks,
T.
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Lithgow View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lithgow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 16 2009 at 8:41am
Some of the pics wont show on my computer.
Does it have the rear mount pad for the scope?
I believe repro mounts are available but have never seen them.
Make it a project, it will be worthwhile.
That rifle has the round cocking peice, not often seen on the number 4.
I am never sure when I hear people say "this was the rifle I carried in the war", I would have thought they were required to hand them in at the end of the war. All the servicemen I know had to hand theirs back. I could be wrong but.
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charly45 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote charly45 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 16 2009 at 10:10am
Still a nice pieceWink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 16 2009 at 10:38am
Numrich arms (e-gunparts.com) is advertising replicas for the pads.
I don't know how accurate a repro they are though.
They also advertise a scope mount, but with a 1" tube ability.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 16 2009 at 2:28pm
Thanks for the responses folks!
I noticed some of the pics were not showing up also, so I will try to repost them here.
As far as the rear pad, yes... it is still there, the screws look to have never been messed with. Not like the front ones though, they were a little bunged up when I got it. Even with the screws out of the front pad, it is solid to the reciever. Probably still soldered on?

Yeah, the old gent we bought it from was a little cooky, so I wouldn't know if he was telling the truth or not... back then I was 12 or so. I was also under the impression that personnel had to turn them in to the armory.. but who knows.

I have been eyeing the repro pads and mount from numrich, and may infact call them about a set soon, but might I ask:
Is there a downside to the 1" tube mount? As opposed to?
I'm not gonna hunt for an original optic for it, so 1" should be fine... right?

Here are the re-pics:










If these don't work, I will try again tomorrow.
Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 16 2009 at 9:55pm
Not really I think the 1" tube bit is just a sales tool as IIRC the old Aldis as issued was a 1" tube anyway.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote No4Enfield Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 17 2009 at 6:40am
Id love to have a (T) Very nice!

AFA it being 'his weapon he carried in the war' IDK, I do know many americans returned home after WWII w/ various treasures and some even finagled their own rifles home somehow
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Target Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 18 2009 at 12:54am
you were given the option to buy your rifle back then i think. At least in the US you were allowed to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote No4Enfield Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 18 2009 at 3:43am
As I recall most British arms were dumped in the channel by their .gov, or so i heard
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 18 2009 at 4:29am
Originally posted by Target Target wrote:

you were given the option to buy your rifle back then i think. At least in the US you were allowed to.
In the U.K. as well.
That's how i got my #4Mk1(T).
Then the authorities made me "Surrender" it  (voluntarily of course, it says so on my "cancelled without prejudice" FAC) when I left.
I wonder if anyone has figured that connection outBig smile
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 12 2010 at 12:27pm
Thread resurrection!

I'd put this rifle project on the back-burner for awhile... hence the reason why I never came back around here to update. So anyway, I decided to take a step forward to get some needed parts to fix this instead of selling it off (since it was free anyway) I just figured it would be a good project, even if it might not be entirely correct historically speaking. 

So, after much searching I have acquired a repro scope mount from Sarco... and I also bought a a front pad from them, in the hopes of replacing the jacked up one that is on the rifle now.
That is where I have ended up in a snag. The pad that I got from Sarco appeared correct in dimensions, but the kicker is: it's not 1/4 BSF thread.... Ermm the mount will not even screw into it. Checking the pad thread at work... it comes out to be M8. E-mailed the seller, no response. I'm not about to try and tap this out since I don't have access to imperial taps here without some serious coinage and I'm not sure if it will even work due to already being threaded. Back to the drawing board methinks. 

Next on the list is to remove the bunk front pad. 
My question is now: How to desolder it safely from the receiver? I've got the tools, but I'm kinda curious if it can be done with MAPP gas torch and light heat. The only gunsmith here won't even touch it, and I'd rather DIY anyway. Oh, and does anyone have a source for the screws... just in case I need replacement.


Regards,
T




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A square 10 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 12 2010 at 12:39pm
interesting savage made rifle , id love to see a lot more photos with lots of details , this looks to be a real nice find 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lithgow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 12 2010 at 7:15pm

Very light heat is all that is needed. Heat the pad only.

Do not heat enough to change colour.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LE Owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 13 2010 at 3:36am
If its a Savage manufactured T it could be one of the six groove trials rifles that were among the first converted for sniper use.
Seems to me there are nominal one inch scope tubes that measure as either 25 mm or 26 mm.
Some scope rings have removable shims to adjust for either.
A gunsmith I knew used to shim 26mm rings with fine brass wire mesh strips to hold 25mm tubes solidly to prevent shifting under heavy recoil. Recently I've sen rings that come with similar shims already in place.
 
PS
The ring of the front pad was probably broken off at some point and the rough edges ground down.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thouston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 13 2010 at 11:26am
@ A square 10:
I'm gonna try and get some more pics of it, I just tried tonight but the light is a little too low for my lens and I don't have a macro for the detail. I'll just do the best I can... should be a couple of days for 'em to be ready... work and all. Anything I should be focusing on pic wise? Thanks for the comment on it also!

Lithgow: Thanks for the info, I'd searched the net and hadn't found anything on pad removal from an enfield, I've got a correct one inbound for the front... and feeling confident.

LE Owner: From all appearances and marks, it looks like a Savage. It's kinda hard to tell the detail from my OP pics, but most were marked US PROPERTY on the receiver... there is a Y sticking out from under the front pad though. It is not stamped with a T. Regarding scope tubes, the repro mount I have is said to be a 1" tube but I have not confirmed that with the micrometer yet... good info! 

Were those front pads that prone to failure that one would break off like that? I see how it could be a weak link from the design, but I'm no engineer. Geek
I think the barrel is a 2 groover, so it isn't a trials rifle?

I'm still learning... 
Regards,
T


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hawgeye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 13 2010 at 2:26pm
Sarco is offering an original front pad for $49.95. They are apparently out of the two pad sets. I tried to order some tonight, but the front pad is still in stock.
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