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A mutt or purebreed?

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SSG Retired View Drop Down
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    Posted: October 05 2020 at 11:55am
Long time listener first time caller. Great site for info. I have been looking at a no 5 mk 1 for years and finally pulled the trigger. found this at an estate sale (400) and am looking for some more help. It seems to be a 1945 no 5 mk 1 but I see this stock is used on the 4s.The cut lines on the barrel cover. also it has bot m47c sight and wrist and m47a stock behind trigger guard on it. the pics are not the best but any help will be appreciated. A mutt? or purebred? Thanks guys

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2020 at 5:44pm
well - it is BSA made but without markings on the left receiver we cannot tell for certain , im not liking that top handguard - not because it aint pretty but because ive never seen that one on a no5 , looks to be for a no4 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Honkytonk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2020 at 7:12pm
Same thought. What does the butt stock, recoil pad and sling swivel look like?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Armourer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 1:22am
Well, it is a No5 body but it certainly has (shall we say) an unusual handguard.

Pictures of the top of the barrel with the handguard removed would confirm that it is a No5 barrel
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pukka Bundook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 5:47am
SSG,
Some No 5's had a No 4  butt stock attached in later years just for shooting, as the sensible recoil is less.  This was after service, not during service, so Could  be a reason for the change. (If it indeed is a No 5)
 
More photos will help).
 
Cheers,
R.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Armourer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 7:50am

Originally posted by Pukka Bundook Pukka Bundook wrote:

SSG,
Some No 5's had a No 4  butt stock attached in later years just for shooting, as the sensible recoil is less.  This was after service, not during service, so Could  be a reason for the change. (If it indeed is a No 5)
 
More photos will help).
 
Cheers,
R.

Look at the 'weight saving' scallop just in front of the rear sight pivot point / partly covered by the safety.
The No 4 doesn't have that, so it is (at least) a No5 body.

The OPs 'No5'


A No4


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSG Retired Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 8:25am
Thanks for the replies. Yes the stock has M47A markings, also the serial #s match it. Here are a few more pics. it is an interesting how it has the M47C on all the parts except the stock. but all the numbers match. guess it was a 4pm on Friday gun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 8:48am
Measure from the rear face of the forend to the back edge of the sling swivel band cut.
The No4 forend which is frequently cut down to make a "Faux" No5 forend is several inches different in this area The No5 being almost 3 1/2" shorter than the No4.
I'd guess the hand guard was cut down from a No4 one. Look at the relationship between the "grasping Groves" & the sling swivel band as well. The actual forend may well be a No5 & just the hand guard replaced.


Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:06am
The #5 rifle had a differently contoured barrel/swivel band than the #4 rifle used.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:17am
Good point, I'd forgotten that!
I wonder if it would work with a no5 forend & a cut-down No4 handguard?
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Armourer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:27am
Thanks for the replies. Yes the stock has M47A markings, also the serial #s match it. Here are a few more pics. it is an interesting how it has the M47C on all the parts except the stock.

BSA had a number of factories in the area around Birmingham, each had the 'parent company' code number of M47 but then each factory had its own suffix, so we had :

M47A
M47B
M47C

Each plant produced different parts.
M47C was the main 'metal fabrication and assembly' operation.
M47A produced the woodwork.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:34am
M47A Small Heath
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:37am
Originally posted by SSG Retired SSG Retired wrote:

Long time listener first time caller. Great site for info. I have been looking at a no 5 mk 1 for years and finally pulled the trigger. found this at an estate sale (400) and am looking for some more help. It seems to be a 1945 no 5 mk 1 but I see this stock is used on the 4s.The cut lines on the barrel cover. also it has bot m47c sight and wrist and m47a stock behind trigger guard on it. the pics are not the best but any help will be appreciated. A mutt? or purebred? Thanks guys
It is a purebred missing the original handguard. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSG Retired Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2020 at 4:49pm
Would one of you SMEs know where I can find an upper hand guard to match the rest of the stock? Also I seen somewhere on the forum something about the "T" on the barrel as a good sign, The bolt also has a "T". I will be shooting this thing this weekend so I will see if it is a good sign.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Armourer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2020 at 1:16am
Originally posted by SSG Retired SSG Retired wrote:

Would one of you SMEs know where I can find an upper hand guard to match the rest of the stock? Also I seen somewhere on the forum something about the "T" on the barrel as a good sign, The bolt also has a "T". I will be shooting this thing this weekend so I will see if it is a good sign.

The T in that position, and marked upside down is simply to show the 'thicko' squaddies which way to point the rifle. You'll never see that on an RAF firearm !!!!!



Seriously ?



No !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2020 at 7:22am
The handguards are as rare as rocking horse poo.
E-Bay maybe, but you'll be paying through the nose for it.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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