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Aftermarket triggers?

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Cliff H View Drop Down
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    Posted: December 03 2010 at 11:19am
Just wondering whats the most popular in here. The only two that i know of is the Huber concepts and the Canwest triggers. Are there any others? Does anybody have any input on either of the two triggers mentioned. Im also wondering if the factory military trigger can be lightened up some? I dont have a problem with the two stage, just the 10lb pull on the second stage!! I would love to do something about my trigger on my #1. I would rather go with the Canwest because it seems similar in build and function to Timney triggers, which i have on a couple of swede mausers that ive sporterized. I just cant afford it, last i checked its running $140.00.   The Huber triggers run about $80. I can afford this one, but its just not that impressive of a trigger to me for some reason. I supose i would like some feedback on the Huber for sure if any of you have went with his trigger.

Thanks all and have a Happy Holidays....Cliff
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Shamu View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 03 2010 at 10:15pm
Adjusting length of first & second pressure is fairly easy, as is changing trigger pressure.
I've done several of them and all you need is a fine stone, some tape, a bit of cardboard & some patience.
***DISCLAIMER!
As always don't mess about with trigger mechanisms unless you are sure of exactly what you are doing**

If you are interested in trying this yourself, let me know & I'll post a how-to with pictures. What is involved is stoning the front edge of the cocking piece where it engages the sear tip so that the angle is changed slightly.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Cliff H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cliff H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2010 at 2:13am
Shamu
    I was hopeing that someone would chime in and say that the military trigger could be reworked. This would be worth trying before i spend any money on the aftermarket versions. Have you measured the amount of pull on the second stage of any of the ones that you reworked. I have to get it down to at least 2-2.5 lb's for my liking.   A how-to with pictures would be great if its not to much trouble! Thanks for the help....Cliff
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cliff H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2010 at 5:03am

I just found this article. This describes the correct and safe way of doing this trigger modification.

http://www.gunreports.com/special_reports/long_guns/GunReports-Working-Lee-Enfield-American-Gunsmith-Gunsmithing-Rifle1858-1.html

In this article the authur goes into discusion about trigger mods and this is what he concluded with.......

"There is a modification that qualified gunsmiths—novices should avoid such work— can make that works very well when done correctly.
Add a small weld bead to the top angle of the sear where it contacts the frame. File it down until it is smooth and to the point where it locks onto the bottom 2 millimeters of the sear face of the cocking piece. You get a smooth trigger pull, a short stroke, and safety all in one. Do not try anything less than a two millimeter latch."

Has anyone done this perticular type of trigger mod??

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2010 at 5:57am
I usually set them up for 2 1/2~# Lbs for first pull & 3 1/2~4 1/2 for second. This was the original spec so it's what I aim for.
As for the "qualified gunsmith remark" I advise folks wanting to try the trigger mod to buy a spare trigger ( $4~10) & work on that one. If they mess up all they have to do is put the original back in.

The weight of pull is a separate operation from the "bump surgery"Sick as most of the work is done to the flat on the cocking piece.  Again I suggest you get a spare & mess with that based on the same idea. Personally I never add anything to the sear, in fact I don't touch it at all. I specifically suggest you do not, ever mess with the height of the piece! as the writer says this is foolhardy & you don't strike me as foolish. You can "tune" the simple mechanism without decreasing safety.

My technique (I didn't invent it, but I do use it) is to change (very slightly) the angle of the bent (mating face) on the bottom front of the piece so that the sear slides over the surface with less effort. Essentially I polish the surface mirror smooth while angling the stone slightly. The combination of reduced friction & a smoother contact makes other work (IMHO) unneeded. You can make jigs from cardboard to both protect the bottom of the bolt cylinder, & keep the angle of the stone consistent.

I do suggest taking care as you are messing with the fire control assembly of a rifle, but it is not impossible it just requires a realistic self evaluation of you skill level. If you can file, grind, or polish a flat surface without curving it then you can do this, if you always have a "bit of a curve you can't explain" then you probably shouldn't.

Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cliff H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2010 at 12:49pm
Yea I alleady have been looking out for a spare trigger or two just to practice on. I dont think Im sold on the mod in the article just yet. Not quite sure whats going on with that mod anyway. I'll have to talk with my Gunsmith to see if he can explain exactly what that mod is actually doing for the trigger. As far as my skills, Im capable of just polishing and slightly changing the angle of the bent. Im looking forward to seeing your How-to. Thanks for the incouragement by the way. Ive actually done some of this same type of work on a couple of older Crosman pellet pistols that i have. And they turned out great, compared to what they were.

So to lighten up the second stage to say 2-2.5 lbs, is this done by putting more angle on the bent?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tony Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2010 at 4:10pm
Be careful. Lightly polish the trigger but remember a hair trigger is potentially lethal.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2010 at 9:29pm
Yes as you make the bent angle sharper the sear nose has less friction & so slides easier reducing friction & so weight of pull. The trick is to change the angle by a very slight & predetermined amount.

I'd be a little nervous making the second pull so light by the way. You need a first pressure because of the design & it's not a good idea to have first & second so close to each other & first is created by the tension of the "V" spring so you can't change it much at all. If I were doing this I'd call a safe minimum 4Lbs. Anything beyond that & you're heading for trouble.

Whatever you do, check for safe operation after doing it!
Cock an EMPTY rifle & bang the butt sharply on the floor, it shouldn't fire.
Drop a cocked EMPTY rifle with the safety engaged in the same way, it shouldn't fire.
Disengage the safety, it shouldn't fire either.

Sorry to be repetitive but you need to take great good care when doing this type of work. Give me a couple of days & I'll post the pictures & diagrams of how to do this without endangering the operation of the rifle.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 06 2010 at 10:53pm
Assuming you have the spares fitted.
Here's the official method, complete with a diagram.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 06 2010 at 11:00pm
What you are doing is to smooth & polish the surface marked as "A" so that the sear "C" can slide along the face with minimum resistance. Frequently if you look at the "A" surface you'll actually see a groove or trough worn across the face. Usually all that is needed is to buff the face to make it mark-free & mirror finished. I do this with the bolt assembled, but removed from the rifle & I wrap the bolt shaftin tape & card to give me a guide for the correct angle. I only use a hard arkansas stone with oil to polish, moving the face vertically only, never horizontally. I strip, reassemble & test frequently as I go & I ABSOLUTELY ALWAYS test for function of the bolt, sear & safety after doing any such work. Any issue, no matter how minor & I go back to the original parts untill I can figure out & fix whatever problem I've created by tinkering.
As a final touch I clean the mechanism at the first & second pressure bumps on the trigger & lightly grease the flat shaft of the sear where they make contact ("B" & "D"). I also put a small dab of grease on the bolt's cocking piece face.
I would only go to a slick 3 1/2~4 1/2 Lbs doing this & Iwould absolutely avoid any removal of metal from the underside of the cocking piece, this is just getting too light for safety. If you can't live with a slick 4Lb pull then you really need to get an aftermarket trigger which is redesigned to give that very light pull with safety. Personally I'm very happy with a good 2-stage 4 1/2 Lb trigger so I do the mod being discussed. Try a good pull, ait heavier than you're asking for first & see how it works for you, if it doesn't then get the aftermarket trigger, put the original parts back on the bolt & chalk it all up to experience.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cliff H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 08 2010 at 2:38am
Shamu, your the man.  Thanks so much for the help.  I'll surely take my time with this and triple check all safety precautions as I go.   I could be happy with a 3.5-4 lb trigger pull over a $80-130 aftermarket trigger anyday!
 
Did the illustration come out of a book of somekind?  Ive been wanting to get the How to accuraize a enfield rifle book ever since i saw it on the net a few weeks ago.  Did this come from that book?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 08 2010 at 5:27am
It came from an old armorer's manual reprint I found at a gunshow.
I've been collecting info on the rifles for quite a while & have a reasonable amount of stuff on the #4 models.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aifwikir Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 09 2010 at 9:16am
WOW!  Now I have a Winter project that doesn't involve my motorcycle.  Thanks Shamu!  Great info.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 09 2010 at 9:55am
You could just bring it to the pool.Star
That's where I messed with FIRESTARTER's trigger & his mind.
You should have seen the look on his face when I attacked his Irish contract with a Leatherman & increased his trigger pull at first!
Fortunately I was able to fix the problem & he left with a nice 4 1/2 Lb pull.

Now if we could get DELTA-10 involved that would probably be a 1 1/2 Lb pull that was safeClap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aifwikir Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 10 2010 at 10:20pm
I thought mine was already a nice pull, it's setting at about 6# but smooth.  A little bit long but not bad for a military trigger.
 
:D
Aif
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 11 2010 at 1:27am
That's nice for an Enfield.
IIRC the spec was 3 1/2 # for first stage & 4~ 51/2# for second stage.

Hey you hit stuff you aim at with it so it can't be too badThumbs Up
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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