Enfield Rifle Cases |
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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Posted: February 06 2022 at 1:48pm |
I purchased these two rifle cases from 1942 and 1943 respectively. I researched the Broad Arrow 2 for the manufacturer identifiers and could only locate D&M Ltd, a british manufacturer identified as a Oil Bottle SMLE WWI. I could not locate the M&Q or D^126. I have a lot of questions: 1) Can you identify the manufacturer or the national origin? 2) The webbing/material is quite different between the two - this is probably significant. 2) The external pouch opens in opposite directions (one towards butt, the other towards barrel) 3) My No.1 MkIII* doesn't quite fit - the rifle fits in, but the closing flap wont close - maybe 1-2" short. This was disappointing. I thought maybe these were Canadian and/or designed for the No.4 and I checked the overall rifle dimensions - they vary by 0.1" (44.5 for the No.1 and 44.4 for the No.4) so this is likely not the problem. I have one other rifle case almost identical to the D^126 and my No1 MkIII* rifle fits perfectly. Could the case shrink this much over the years? A couple of usage questions: What goes in the external pouch - I assume ammo? Where does the solider store his bayonet? And finally, how were these deployed in the army - would a soldier carry a case into forward deployment, or would they be used on base, or training etc? Looking forward to the conversation. NOTE: EDITED TO REMOVE THE FAULTY IMAGES. |
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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I can't get the images to post. They are jpg files and meet the size requirements. I'll keep experimenting. Stand by. |
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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Let's try this - two photo's of the D&M marked case: |
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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Two photo's of the D^126 case - I don't why the originals didn't load, but I changed the file names to remove any special characters (^, -, &) and the images loaded. Something to keep in mind: |
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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A square 10
Special Member Donating Member Joined: December 12 2006 Location: MN , USA Status: Offline Points: 14452 |
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interesting topic , i was not really a web collector except to have a few holsters and such so i never really did a lot of reading on this area , i do have a case similar to what you show tho so i am interested in seeing what those that know post ,
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SGonger
Senior Member Joined: February 20 2021 Location: Utah U.S.A Status: Offline Points: 418 |
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Howdy y’all.
Believe your shorter bag is made for the No5 Mk1 (Jungle Carbine,have a few but are (D^D M.H&Co 43thru45 dated made). Cheer’s.
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Anyone seen the Tardis Box anywhere? 🤨
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Zed
Special Member Donating Member Joined: May 01 2012 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 5586 |
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Interesting that they would make a bag for the No5 Mk1 before start of rifle production. (02/44)
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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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The Jungle carbines are all shorter - 39.X inches, so they definitely would fit. So although the cases predated the Jungle Carbines, it is an interesting train of thought to explore which other rifles may fit. I flipped through my bible (LES) and I had to go back to the MLE Carbines to get lengths at 39.X inches, but why would the commonwealth make cases for the MLEs in 1942/43? |
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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SGonger
Senior Member Joined: February 20 2021 Location: Utah U.S.A Status: Offline Points: 418 |
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^^^👍🍻 Running a couple of inquiries on manufacturer marking to maybe narrow things down. I can’t find that marking anywhere 🤢 Cheer’s.
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Anyone seen the Tardis Box anywhere? 🤨
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Zed
Special Member Donating Member Joined: May 01 2012 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 5586 |
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Is it possible that the 1942 D&M case is a fake?
The stitching appears to be very clean for an 80 year old canvas case.
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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
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shiloh
Senior Member Joined: January 08 2019 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 2369 |
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I have both original and a reproduction webbing of which most repro`s are made in India. The repro`s use a very coarse fabric compared to the originals, the weave threads are 2-3x`s heavier. The original fabric is not to unlike a fine oil skin canvas. My Guess would be the DM marked one is a repro.
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Lead from the front; eliminate all obstacles...
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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That's a little disappointing - I don't mind buying a repro if I know its a repro. Let's see if sgonger comes back with any additional insight. Otherwise, I continue to learn the hard way :) Fortunately it was a modest investment.
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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SGonger
Senior Member Joined: February 20 2021 Location: Utah U.S.A Status: Offline Points: 418 |
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Howdy; I’ll ditto what Mr Shiloh stated had the same conclusion. We had no joy in trying to find anything about the M&Q marking sorry. |
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Anyone seen the Tardis Box anywhere? 🤨
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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OK. Thanks all for the research and comments. I'll continue to research webbing so maybe I get the originals next time.
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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SGonger
Senior Member Joined: February 20 2021 Location: Utah U.S.A Status: Offline Points: 418 |
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Goodo & just for a thought mate,I trimmed a couple of the buckles on the carbine type bags & restiched the buckles higher up so they would inclose a MKIII rifle. 🤭😉👍 Cheer’s.
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Anyone seen the Tardis Box anywhere? 🤨
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AussieShooter
Senior Member Joined: April 14 2019 Location: Chicago, IL Status: Offline Points: 343 |
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Great minds think a like. I laid the "shorty" against the "longy" and realized something similar. It appears the buckle strap may have been a little lower. However, look at these close-ups of the buckle. The buckle on the flap is fixed and rigid. This looks too complex to be a repro - maybe O'm in denial. not sure it's for a No1, but not a repro? |
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"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates |
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