Enfield-Rifles Forum Virtual Match

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   Here is a first time entry.  I have shot a number of targets at 50 and 25 yards trying to get the hang of shooting the No 2 Mk IV trainer unsupported.  It's a challenge at my age but I produced one target today that is nearly worth posting.  Let me know if you see any issues. Thanks for keeping up this match.
09/12/22
Lee Enfield 22 Trainer Match
Seated at bench, unsupported
Enfield No 2 Mk IV
SK High Velocity Match
25 Yards (Ray-Vin Publishing Co. reduced target)
75 degrees, sunny, light and variable breeze
87-0X

If there is a limit on tries per month, I have probably exceeded it.

I'm having more success at 25 vs 50 shooting the trainer because I can use a +1 reader to help me focus on the front sight.  At 50 yards, the target is just too blurry with the reader.  Without the reader I get good focus on the target but a bit of fuzz on the front sight.  And I'm obviously still working on sighting in for elevation, but the spread is mostly the septuagenarian shakes.

(I understand that moderators will review this new guy submission before posting.)

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Wilson Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: April 16 2022 Location: North Alabama Status: Offline Points: 2	Post Options Post Reply Quote Wilson Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 12 2022 at 3:58pm
	Here is a first time entry. I have shot a number of targets at 50 and 25 yards trying to get the hang of shooting the No 2 Mk IV trainer unsupported. It's a challenge at my age but I produced one target today that is nearly worth posting. Let me know if you see any issues. Thanks for keeping up this match. 09/12/22 Lee Enfield 22 Trainer Match Seated at bench, unsupported Enfield No 2 Mk IV SK High Velocity Match 25 Yards (Ray-Vin Publishing Co. reduced target) 75 degrees, sunny, light and variable breeze 87-0X If there is a limit on tries per month, I have probably exceeded it. I'm having more success at 25 vs 50 shooting the trainer because I can use a +1 reader to help me focus on the front sight. At 50 yards, the target is just too blurry with the reader. Without the reader I get good focus on the target but a bit of fuzz on the front sight. And I'm obviously still working on sighting in for elevation, but the spread is mostly the septuagenarian shakes. (I understand that moderators will review this new guy submission before posting.)

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Shamu Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admin Group Logo Designer / Donating Member Joined: April 25 2007 Location: MD, USA. Status: Offline Points: 15950	Post Options Post Reply Quote Shamu Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 12 2022 at 4:35pm
	Somebody already did! I think you're slightly misunderstanding the use of Iron sights. But I applaud you ingenuity in thinking it out! The front sight IS where you focus your eyes, irrespective of distance to target! Yes it will be blurry, but aim for the center of the blur! I'm not being "snarky", I'm 73 in a few weeks, but here's how it works. If you're "off" (because of blur) at the target you're off by maybe 1/8". BUT if you're "off" at the front/rear sight alignment, you're off by probably 3~4" at the target! Oh, Welcome to the club of those who try! I've had some "Technical Difficulties" with my .22 SMLE conversion ('Smith sat on it for 15 months AFTER I gave him a deposit of 50%) & then I moved & discovered it. But I have a member on here who says he can do it. He's going to get the 'Smiths' quoted price for it too.
	Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)

britrifles Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: February 03 2018 Location: Atlanta, GA Status: Offline Points: 5096	Post Options Post Reply Quote britrifles Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 12 2022 at 5:04pm
	Wilson, welcome to the forum. There is no limit on how many tries or targets you post. The idea is to encourage us to get out and shoot and improve our skills. I agree with Shamu, you must be able to see the front sight clearly. The No.1 series of rifles (including the No. 2 trainer) has the added difficulty of having to see the top of the rear sight clearly as well so that it is aligned with the top surface of the front sight. Readers will help you with that. Try a few different lens strengths to see what gives you the sharpest sight picture, a blurry target is fine, align the sights so the blurry black target sits on top of the sharp front sight image. You will also find that using a sling will give you a much steadier hold on the rifle and shrink the group size.

Zed Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Special Member Donating Member Joined: May 01 2012 Location: France Status: Online Points: 5168	Post Options Post Reply Quote Zed Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 13 2022 at 4:28am
	Wilson, welcome to the forum. The .22's are addictive! I also have issues focusing on the front sights. I use a +1 reading lens insert in my safety glasses. As mentioned already, it's essential to see the front sight clearly. What makes a huge difference is fitting a match dioptre type sight to the rear. I use one on my 1918 SMLE .22. It really helps visual alignment.
	It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!

britrifles Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: February 03 2018 Location: Atlanta, GA Status: Offline Points: 5096	Post Options Post Reply Quote britrifles Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 13 2022 at 6:54am
	No doubt, an aperture (peep) rear sight will provide a higher degree of accuracy than the open notch rear sight. The front sight will naturally center in the rear aperture subconsciously. A small diameter aperture will also increase your depth of focus, just like it does with a camera lens, and that is significant with aging eyesight. Unfortunately, the target type rear aperture sights for the LE's are getting rather expensive and hard to find, particularly for the No. 1 (or No. 2) rifles. Wilson, I suspect the vertical spread your getting is related to keeping a consistent front sight position within the notch of the rear sight. You have to concentrate on keeping the top of the front sight level with the top edge of the rear sight; all at the same time, keeping the front sight at the bottom of the black "fuzzy" aiming mark. It takes a lot of practice to perfect.

Zed Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Special Member Donating Member Joined: May 01 2012 Location: France Status: Online Points: 5168	Post Options Post Reply Quote Zed Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 13 2022 at 11:59am
	Here's my Lithgow built No2MkIV* that was fitted with a Parker Match sight. The target was shot at 50 yards. I now have this sight on my 1929 BSA made .303 SMLE for the Modified Service Rifle competitions. My 1918 SMLE .22 currently has an AG Parker No9 rear sight. below. These are really great fun to shoot!
	It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!

Wilson Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: April 16 2022 Location: North Alabama Status: Offline Points: 2	Post Options Post Reply Quote Wilson Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 17 2022 at 8:15am
	Thanks for the welcome and the advice. I have two of the trainers, so maybe I'll look for an aperture sight at some point. But for now I'll be working on shooting them as they came.

Shamu Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admin Group Logo Designer / Donating Member Joined: April 25 2007 Location: MD, USA. Status: Offline Points: 15950	Post Options Post Reply Quote Shamu Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: September 17 2022 at 2:57pm
	There's another alternative for less $$$ a "peep sight blade" that replaces the factory "Open Irons" It's a blade that's bigger & taller & has an aperture! Basically you unscrew the regular blade (its Staked so proceed with caution, it will be stubborn) & then insert & bolt down the now taller one with a "peep hole". Failing that, we have the stick on apertures that go on your safety glasses, or the \lack electrical tape with a hole punched in it as the cheaper than dirt alternative. Give 'em a shot (apologies for the terrible pun)
	Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)

shiloh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: January 08 2019 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 1786	Post Options Post Reply Quote shiloh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 9:56am
	Last submission for this yr, shot with the Bisley clone, 100 yrs unsupported, in sling seated at the bench. Speer 150grn sp. As good as it gets..lol 96-4X
	shoot em if you got em

Goosic Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: September 12 2017 Location: Phoenix Arizona Status: Offline Points: 7684	Post Options Post Reply Quote Goosic Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 9:59am
	Truly awesome shooting there shiloh...

Olddust Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: April 23 2021 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 130	Post Options Post Reply Quote Olddust Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 10:36am
	Nice shooting. Love to see the targets up. I hope to get one more in before the years end. Great idea this shoot.

Honkytonk Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: December 30 2017 Location: Brandon Mb Status: Offline Points: 4489	Post Options Post Reply Quote Honkytonk Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 11:06am
	Very fine shooting! Nice job on the rifle!

britrifles Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: February 03 2018 Location: Atlanta, GA Status: Offline Points: 5096	Post Options Post Reply Quote britrifles Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 12:24pm
	A lot can be learned by studying groups. This is a good target, and I see potential for something even better. Your windage spread is very good indeed, well within the 10 ring size, in fact, only one shot is outside the width of the X ring. I suspect you might have a little trouble with a consistent point of aim vertically. Are you using a 6 O'clock hold on the black or taking a center of mass (center of target)? I bet you can get this rifle to shoot a clean score, all in the 10 ring with a high X ring count.

shiloh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: January 08 2019 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 1786	Post Options Post Reply Quote shiloh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 1:02pm
	6 O`clock hold, 60% perfect, I do find it hard to maintain that consistent POA. A 1/4" sliver of white looks the same to me as a 1/2-3/4" sliver at 100yrs??
	shoot em if you got em

Shamu Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admin Group Logo Designer / Donating Member Joined: April 25 2007 Location: MD, USA. Status: Offline Points: 15950	Post Options Post Reply Quote Shamu Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 1:06pm
	Maybe a little "Vertical Stringing"? Its hard to say with out knowing the sequence of when each hole was placed in the string. How long between shots?
	Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)

britrifles Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: February 03 2018 Location: Atlanta, GA Status: Offline Points: 5096	Post Options Post Reply Quote britrifles Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: November 01 2022 at 1:14pm
	Inconsistent sling tension could do that too, several possibilities here. I typically find my groups are a bit larger vertically than horizontally, mostly due to difficulty in keeping a consistent vertical POA. Some shooters do better with a center of mass hold on the black, but you got to have good eyesight for that.