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Is there an Engineer in the room?

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Honkytonk View Drop Down
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    Posted: July 31 2018 at 7:39am
Sorry. Had to make one last Engineer stab. I've been shooting alot of 180's and 150's lately out of all my Enfield, except the No5 Battle Carbine. Without going into load detail, by the book, the 180's are about 2300 ft/sec, the 150's about 2450. The 180's shoot about 4" higher than the 150's. I suspect it's inertia or some other phenomenom. My friends are having a hard time believing it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Canuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2018 at 8:05am
I'm sure one or more of our in-house ballistic wizards can explain this. Most of my #4/5's shoot 3-4 inches high with 180 grain soft point hunting ammo using factory iron sights set at the 100 mark, but I set the factory rear ladder sights down as far as they can go with great results.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2018 at 9:52am
Barrel harmonics are different, the muzzle is at a different point of its cycle when the 150 & 180's depart the muzzle.
http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z149/AtomicPinUp/Benchrest/Barrel%20Harmonics_zpsmxtzgudy.jpg
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2018 at 10:50am
What?
Loose wimmen tightened here
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Honkytonk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2018 at 2:30pm
Hoadie. I second that thought. What?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2018 at 6:24pm
ok..that means it Paddy ofurniture's turn in the barrel.
Loose wimmen tightened here
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 02 2018 at 7:18pm
Slower bullet leaves at higher angle of departure. Known as “compensation”, further down range the MPI comes together for the fast and slow bullets.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Honkytonk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2018 at 5:10am
I always thought the bullet never goes higher than the axis of the barrel. Thanks for the clarification.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2018 at 7:15am
It doesn't, but this is a combination of barrel harmonics and the fact that as a shoulder fired weapon, with the barrel axis above the butt plate, the muzzle will rise from recoil while the bullet is still in the barrel.  Slower bullet has longer time for muzzle to rise.  I have found some differences in how the rifle is stocked up; "center" or "mid" bearing bedded; which is the harmonic effects coming into play. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote englishman_ca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2018 at 8:23am
Britrifles is giving a much simplified the description of the compensation effect of the barrel in a Lee Enfield. But he is not wrong.

The slender barrel flexes as the bullet travels though it, not unlike a buggy whip. Hence the stocking up of the rifle has a dramatic effect on accuracy.

All very clever stuff that was put there by design, not by accident. Enfield engineers were brilliant!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2018 at 10:31am
Hey, we have someone on the forum that appreciates Engineers!  Englishman_ca, you might be the only one!  Smile
 
Yes, it was a simple explanation.  Too many engineers like to give complicated explanations for something that is really not that complicated.  The point of tuning handloads is to try and get the bullet to leave the barrel at or near the extreme of the muzzle deflection, where it is momentarily motionless; otherwise the bullets will have a variable angle of departure and variable initial velocity perpendicular to the axis of the barrel.   Stocking up can change the barrel harmonics, shift the position along the barrel where the bending nodes are (points of zero, or near zero deflection).  My center bedded No. 4 Mk I shoots differently than my middle bearing bedded No. 4 Mk 2.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote englishman_ca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2018 at 10:49am
I am from a mechanical background. I am the guy that does the design and draws the blue prints for the engineers to stamp.

The kid that would take all his toys apart to see how they worked (hmmm, sixty years later, I still do that).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2018 at 8:00pm
me too - i also appreciate - its just that my current situation find a lot of them wanting , doing the whole job you are paid for would be a good start but then i am speaking of the ones i deal with every day - not you or those that are engaged in full service to their customers , 

i admire great engineering , great machinist work , all that is great in life is honestly credited to those that do , 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2018 at 7:22am
I think the industry varies.  I'm in aerospace, all design work is done by engineers.  Civil engineering is a different matter. 
 
One of the reasons I enjoy the Velocette is I appreciate the clever engineering that went into the development of these motorcycles.  The OHC single 350 cc engine they developed back in the 1920's for the KTT production racer was far ahead of its time, set new world records.  That engine eventually developed 40 BHP, which is still remarkable today for a 350 cc single.  Velocette developed the swinging arm rear suspension, the first positive stop foot gear shift, and many other things that became the standard for all motorcycles to this day.   
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stanforth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2018 at 8:35am
Life.. a sexually transmitted condition that is invariably fatal.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stanforth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2018 at 8:36am
Sorry if you have seen it before.... but any excuse..
Life.. a sexually transmitted condition that is invariably fatal.
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