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Lothar-Walther No.4 barrels

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Long branch View Drop Down
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    Posted: November 20 2019 at 7:25am
There is a lot of controversy surrounding the Criterion No.4 enfield barrels, specifically their. 314" groove diameter. So, I contacted Lothar Walther in Cumming, GA to see if they could cut me one with a .312" bore. The gentleman I spoke to informed me that their German branch was already manufacturing No.4 barrels, and they have plans to release them in the US around the middle of next year. I asked him what the specs were. He said that he didn't know, but he looked on the German site, got the metric specs, and converted them to inches.

They have .303 bores and .314 grooves dangit! Angry

Both the employee and myself were surprised, as he is an enfield shooter himself. He told me to send an email to their sales department, and maybe they could get some information as to why they use those specs. I'll let you know if I get anything useful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Honkytonk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2019 at 8:01am
I've been reading a bit about the 25-303. I believe it was/is popular down under. Can any of our ANZAC members confirm? I've never heard of or seen one in Canada. Might be interesting on a well turned Sporter!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lee7.62 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2019 at 10:37am
Originally posted by Long branch Long branch wrote:

There is a lot of controversy surrounding the Criterion No.4 enfield barrels, specifically their. 314" groove diameter. So, I contacted Lothar Walther in Cumming, GA to see if they could cut me one with a .312" bore. The gentleman I spoke to informed me that their German branch was already manufacturing No.4 barrels, and they have plans to release them in the US around the middle of next year. I asked him what the specs were. He said that he didn't know, but he looked on the German site, got the metric specs, and converted them to inches.

They have .303 bores and .314 grooves dangit! Angry

Both the employee and myself were surprised, as he is an enfield shooter himself. He told me to send an email to their sales department, and maybe they could get some information as to why they use those specs. I'll let you know if I get anything useful.
he!!o, there is a gunsmith located in Sydney Australia 🇦🇺 and I think he already has what your looking for. The Lothar-Walther barrels have been available for quite a while for the No4 I think. Thomas Smith is his name if I remember correctly....check out/
Look up www.t-boneshipwrighting.com.au
Co-incidentally this gentleman was the gunsmith that set up my No4 7.62...with an Armallon bbl.
Good luck with it 👍
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Long branch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2019 at 12:40pm
The question is, can I get an Armalon here in the US. Do they have the same .314 dia.?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2019 at 3:08pm
I wonder if there is a ".25 Ackley Improved" or a ".25/03 Epps" out there's somewhere?
For soft skinned game it would be impressive.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2019 at 3:10pm
Isn't the nominal groove depth 0.005 for Enfield rifling?  I'll have to look it up.  That would be a groove diameter of 0.313. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Armourer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2019 at 12:14am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2019 at 2:43am
For comparisons, I have checked the lands and grooves of my No4Mk1* Long Branch with the previously unissued two groove barrel.  0.3035" for the lands and 0.3125" for the grooves. The width of the grooves being 0.0035". To date,I have only fired 50 rounds down range with it. 
It is my personal belief that,between the two companies of Lothar-Walther and Criterion who both indicate that the depths of their respective No4 contoured barrels are 0.314" be used if finances allow. The 0.3140" groove depth only allows for better bullet expansion during the bullets travel upon firing. I also did a comparison check between an advertised. 308" 168grn Hornady A-Max and an advertised. 311" 174grn Hornady BTHP. 0.3035" for the .308 projectile,and 0.308 for the .311 projectile respectively.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tonsper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2019 at 9:49pm
HT, 

I have in my toy collection a SMLE No1 Mk1 that has been sporterized and re-barrelled to what I call 250/303. It shoots very well and is accurate. I reload for it using 303 Brit brass by sizing it full size, then using a modified 7mm-08 die to neck it down then a modified 25 ACP die for final neck size. 

Unfortunately, I am now in Mexico for the winter and cannot have it here so it is locked up at home. Attached are a couple of pics of it.










Waiting for first light. Shook hands with the devil.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Long branch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 6:20pm
Originally posted by Goosic Goosic wrote:

For comparisons, I have checked the lands and grooves of my No4Mk1* Long Branch with the previously unissued two groove barrel.  0.3035" for the lands and 0.3125" for the grooves. The width of the grooves being 0.0035". To date,I have only fired 50 rounds down range with it. 
It is my personal belief that,between the two companies of Lothar-Walther and Criterion who both indicate that the depths of their respective No4 contoured barrels are 0.314" be used if finances allow. The 0.3140" groove depth only allows for better bullet expansion during the bullets travel upon firing. I also did a comparison check between an advertised. 308" 168grn Hornady A-Max and an advertised. 311" 174grn Hornady BTHP. 0.3035" for the .308 projectile,and 0.308 for the .311 projectile respectively.

If that's the case, I won't be buying any more bullets from them. I measured my .308 sierras and they are .308" on the nose.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 7:05pm
Check this out Long Branch. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 7:15pm
Two more I forgot about. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Long branch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 7:49pm
Goosic, are you sure your calipers are accurate? It seems like all those bullets are about .003 smaller than advertised. That's an odd coincidence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 8:01pm
I am without a doubt that the caliper is accurate. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pukka Bundook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 8:08pm
Goosic,
I have some calipers like that as well.  They measure three thou light.  More at a larger dimension.
I checked mine against my Starret micrometer and they are definitely off.
The starret is old but dead on the money, as is my set of vernier (non-digital ) calipers.
 
The troubling thing is that my digital that throw light, were given me by my son-in -law, and he's  a heavy duty mechanic!!   Makes me wonder if all parts are fitted "Nearly right" !
 
Edited to say you posted whilst I was writing my reply.
I can only suggest getting a good micrometer (not digital) and check it out.
 
Edited again to say I have been measuring Hornady and Lapua bullets very recently, and found them both dead on what they say on the box.   (But three thou light with my digital calipers)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2019 at 8:19pm
I have a Brown&Sharpe Mfg Co  caliper that is old but still accurate.  I use it to check true on my dial calipers. 
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