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Magazine Cut off - 1907 SMLE

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MarkG View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarkG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 14 2018 at 9:35am
The Webley and very similar Enfield revolvers were the normal British officer's handgun from about 1880 to 1950. If you look at pictures of officers leading men into battle in WWI and WWI, they'll probably be holding one. An early Webley model was even used at Rorke's Drift, as immortalized in Zulu.

I've been looking for a shootable Brown Bess over here, but they're pretty darn expensive! That one looks very nice.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 14 2018 at 11:21am
Thanks. It took me some time to find one that was right and needless to say got a lot of help from much more knowledgeable people than I. They are even more messed around with than Enfields, if that is possible. And it could shoot but I wouldn't want to risk a 200+ year old gun.
 
I took a look at the Webley after you posted. I hadn't considered a revolver, but it may be a departure from the rifles, but would not sit on my rack so still need another one.
 
The idea for the Martini Henry is to get a Rourke's Drift era one, which I believe is the Mk4 like in A Sq's post, but stand to be corrected.
 
We are off to the Imperial War Museum North tomorrow, so will hopefully see some nice stuff.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarkG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 14 2018 at 11:29am
Yeah, I would feel bad if I bought a rifle that had survived 200 years before me, and managed to blow it up!

I went to the IWM when I was visiting the UK a few years ago, and there was lots of interesting stuff. Would be even more interesting now I'd know what I'm looking at :).

I think that's where they have the WWI Lee-Enfield with two bullets stuck in its barrel, where a British and German soldier fired at each other at about the same time, and the German bullet went down the Enfield's barrel just as the British soldier was firing at him.

I believe the Rorke's Drift Martini-Henrys would have been earlier than the Mk 4, but I'm not certain of that. However, there's not a huge difference between them; it's more enhancements than redesigns: I think the earlier ones are just more likely to have actually been used in anger.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote terrylee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 14 2018 at 2:38pm
Yes, Rourke's Drift was in 1879 and the Mk.IV Martini Henry was only introduced in about 1886. Rather a Mk.I or possibly an early Mk.II or I/II. I attach a photo of a Mk.I which was recovered in Zululand and is marked to the 80th Regiment who received a very bloody nose at the n'Tombi Drift.
 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 3:35am
That's a remarkable story about the two bullets in one rifle. I wonder what happened to the soldier. Anyway, we will have to wait for another day as a my daughter, whom we were of to see, is poorly, so we are now not going to IWM.
As for the Martini, what a fantastic story behind the gun and such provenance would make it a hugely valuable item, more in terms of historic, although I am sure monetarily as well. There something quite pleasing about the flat metal above the trigger that makes it look quite modern, or is that just me? I wonder if these a classed as antique as are my Snider and Brown Bess, which are both in that class so do not warrant a FAC. I dare say a BB ball would put a big hole in you, as long as you were close enough to hit, that is. Accuracy was not a strong point, but I guess that is relative for the time. They were used extensively enough so can't have been all bad.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 5:10am
Brown bess was a smooth bore, was it not? As such, there wouldn't be alot of accuracy. BUT...having said that - there is a story I read about a Canadian Militia man at the close of the war of 1812. He was @ the Niagara River & saw an American soldier on the other side among the rocks. He took a wild shot at him & DANG if he didn't hit him!! (apparently killed him, as the story goes).
Guess the odds were like winning the lottery!

Martini Henry..Brian wont give OR SELL mine back to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 6:21am
Yes. Smooth bore muzzle loader. Lovely piece of art though, if you can say that about a gun/
Are you sure he didn't just hurl the BB over the river or hit a random rock that caused a landslide? lol.
That would be a shot in a million for a BB. Another good story.
 
You sold your MH?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 6:47am
Originally posted by sc-em sc-em wrote:


Yes. Smooth bore muzzle loader. Lovely piece of art though, if you can say that about a gun/
Are you sure he didn't just hurl the BB over the river or hit a random rock that caused a landslide? lol.
That would be a shot in a million for a BB. Another good story.
 
You sold your MH?



Yes..I was on "hard tmes" back then. (Not as hard as now...but I thought it was.
So Brian stepped in & bought my M/H for $250 Cdn.(To "help me out")

Now, the only way I can get it back is if I offer my Vimy Vet in trade.(& he'll offer some cash, as well.)

I don't know where the M/H has been in it's life - but I DO know where the Vimy Vet was, & what it did!

So, I gotta keep holding out.

(Sad part is he doesn't shoot ANYTHING. They just sit in his cabinet.)

He's got a Civil war cavalry carbine in there as well. Came down thru the family.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 6:54am
I can't comment on non shooting, as I am not yet in a position to spend the hours at a range to get my license.
I am feeling new topic coming on. Tell us about your Vimy Vet.
Pity about your MH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 9:48am
Told the story many times.

I was (at one time) engaged to the grandaughter of the guy that carried it @ Vimy.
His name was MULCAHEY. He took a wound to the face that left him horribly disfigured. he would not allow any pictures be taken of him.
I never met the man, he passed before I came round.
He was allowed to purchase this rifle upon being released from service. It was stored in his son's barn (a WWII vet - Cdn armour) for years & years. I purchased the whole lot of his firearms, & only kept the 1916 BSA.
He was originally issued a ROSS, but when he got to Blighty, he was relieved of it & re-issued a proper Enfield - right out the crate.(New English web gear, as well) They had just enough time to clean them up & they were sent over to the continent. Show didn't last long for him, it seems.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 10:06am
Very interesting indeed. Apologies if it has been written many times, but a good story never fades in the telling.
Am I right, the US didn't enter the war until 1917 once Wilson found his justification, so that gun must have been a very new stock item. How thrilling it must have been...until he reached the front that is.
Oops! Sorry just realised you are Canadian, so of course you were in from the outset.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 3:21pm
10%+ of the entire Canadian population was in uniform & serving in the first twirl at war.
Quite a feat, I'd say.
It was at Vimy - "In those few minutes, I witnessed the birth of a nation".
So it is told.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 15 2018 at 7:17pm
these are the weblets and enfields spoken of above , the 455s mkI throu mkVVI and an enfield mkVI on left , the later enfield 380s on the right with a couple 22 trainers at the bottom right , 





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 16 2018 at 11:06am
Wow! That is some collection you have there. I assume they're yours.
What dates are the rifles?
I am quite taken with the idea of a revolver...blast it! Lol
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