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Need help with to identify barreled receiver found

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pontiacpower View Drop Down
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    Posted: February 25 2012 at 2:21am

Hi I am new to this site and know very little about enfields. I have a no 4 mk1/2 receiver and barrel that i have been trying to identify but it seems to be something different. I believe that it was made by Birmingham Small Arms Factory and was converted from mk1 to mk2 because it has B 55 FTR on side on receiver. The barrel has m/47c 1954 on the side which is BSA I believe. The strange thing is that the serial number is AXXX. It only has 4 total digits and im not sure exactly why......can anyone please help me with some insight? Also there are no import marks any where i can find.

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pontiacpower View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 12:19am
anyone?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muffett.2008 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 3:54am
Post photo's.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 5:13am
Here's my guess, which is what it is without pics or more info.

FTR, (Factory Through Repair) is a full factory overhaul, but not a conversion to Mk2 specs. Now sometimes the old info was removed & the new data re-stamped to avoid confusion. The process was called "scrubbing" I'm curious how you know it's a #4 Mk 1/2 conversion?

It sounds like your rifle was made by BSA earlier, used & then given a full overhaul by BSA in 1955, It was probably done at Fazackerly & the "A XXXX" number would be the one issued by Faz at that time. The old data was scrubbed & replaced by the new.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 5:40am
Because it says NO 4 MK 1/2 on side on receiver......doesnt that mean it was converted?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 5:43am
Also the serial number is Axxx not Axxxx? I havent found anyone else with a serial number like that?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ducaninfrance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 6:50am
  From Skennerton.

Introduced on 31st March 1949 this was a conversion of the No.4 Mk1 to the No.4 Mk 2 pattern with hung trigger. Typical Markings, LH side of Actyion Body    Nº4 Mk 1/2(F)FTR 49

.303 No.4 MkI...
ROF Maltby & Fazakerly, M47C (BSA Shirley)

1941-1945 No letter prefix, then A-Z, then AA-AZ, BA-BZ, etc.,
Early BSA used 4 numbers after prefix letter then all No.4 rifles from all factories used 5 numbers. Fazakerly also used 551-570.

.303 No.4 Mk2, Mk1/2 & Mk1/3. 1948-1957.
ROF Fazakerly PF then A

Hope that helps you a bit.Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 8:51am
this may well have been an early transitional - no1 mkVI/no4 ?
 
but yes the M47C is BSA , the mkI/2 is conversion of an original mkI rifle to mk2 , and it most likely happened at FAZ as most all did ,
the BBL replaced at that FTR 'date' at BSA ?
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 9:54am
The barrel says m47c 1954 the receiver says B FTR 1955. I read something about 1000 prototype rifles that were made to test mk 1 to mk 2 conversion and A prefix with 3 numbers after. Has anyone heard of this? Everyone keeps listing info for A prefix with 4 numbers which this is not. The serial number is A60x
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 12:44pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ducaninfrance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 27 2012 at 5:07pm
Everyone keeps listing info for A prefix with 4 numbers which this is not. The serial number is A60x

People post what information they have in an effort to help others with questions.
This information is not just off the top of their head, I spent about ¾ hour looking through my copy of Skennerton and writing up the details.

Perhaps you could be a bit clearer regarding the 1000 prototypes you read about and also post more pictures of the relevant parts of the rifle that are stamped. 

On page 495 Technical Details it says that
"Some 100 were also converted by BSA Shirley and assigned troop trials rifle serial numbers. e.g. Axxx, even though the action bodies were not originally trials types."

So, lets see some more pictures that show all the stampings and perhaps someone can expand on what has already been offered.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 28 2012 at 12:47am
I found this while trying to find more info: The Fazakerly conversions will read FTR (F) and the date of the conversion with the original serial number re-used and usually all of the original markings are retained.

BSA, on the other hand, did exactly the same conversions and will read FTR 1954, B 55 FTR, B 56 FTR and Krinko's FTR 1957 but almost all examples I have seen have had the original markings removed and a new "A" prefix serial number assigned. It is well known BSA did FTR's on No.1 Mk. III's, 1953 being the only date I've seen on a Mk. III FTR. The markings on the No.4 FTR's are exactly the same and I have yet to see a No.4 with a FTR 1953 date on it.

They are an interesting rifle variant of the 1/2's and 1/3's in that BSA did the conversions. I'm quite sure there are those out there who are sticking to what the books say about Fazakerly being the only arsenal to do the 1/2 and 1/3 conversions but I have 12 or more examples that clearly say different.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pontiacpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 28 2012 at 12:55am

What exact areas should I take photos of? I appreciate the help from you guys!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alan de Enfield Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 28 2012 at 1:13am
Ok - time to post a few facts.
 
* BSA undertook a huge FTR programme in the mid 50's (54, 55, 56)
* The B marking shows it was an FTR done by BSA rather than the commonly recognised Fazakerly plant
* The BSA FTR's were all renumbered starting at A1, A2 etc. etc.
* BSA used all sorts of parts in the FTR (a Savage with a Longbranch bolt has been seen) - all correct but scrubbed and renumbered.
* The rifles were upgraded to Mk1/2 or Mk1/3 as required.
* BSA, being a private company purchased hundreds of thousands of No4 rifles from the MoD during the 50's and 60's for modification and sale to the emerging armies wishing to divest themselves of their old No1's
* The Sierra Leone and Ghana Armies were BIG buyers of these rifles

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