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NOS No 4 Mk 1 Tie Plate Pin needed

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Fazak48 View Drop Down
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    Posted: September 10 2020 at 10:46am
Any Ideas on where to find or how to replace  the brass  tie strap pin on a No 4 Mk 1 ?  The rifle as obtained had a pin but the peened head on one side was missing so I risk cracking the forend further after repairs to existing minor ones without it.
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philtno View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote philtno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 10 2020 at 11:57pm
Hi Fazak48,
I think you might be luckier if you would first introduce yourself to the forum members, maybe tell them a little bit about yourself and how/why you came onto this forum....there is a section just for that Wink
Also, a bit of courtesy is always appreciated....you know, saying "Hi"..."Thanks"..that kind of things Wink before asking for something.....just me saying Big smile
Other than that, be welcome. This is the right place for good advice and soaking into the experience of the "old" members LOL
Cheers from New Zealand
Philtno
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 11 2020 at 4:14pm
welcome aboard , im certain someone will come along thats been buying bits recently with ideas of where you might try , i have not so i cannot help with what your seeking , goosic may have an idea on how to make your own , 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doco Overboard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 11 2020 at 5:48pm
I bought a small brass rod. 1/8' or something like that . Heated it up to anneal it, drove it through the tie plate and then carefully peened it over.

When you first drive the rod through, make sure you can slightly compress the tie plate so a very small amount of in-letting may be in order.
By doing so,  the plate will grip the rod due to the force of the compression and the angle at which the rod protrudes through the holes. Rounding the end of the pin over is just icing on the cake so to speak.
Sort of like a sliding tent pole arrangement.

Back the pin up with a "dolly" to keep it tight or moving the opposite side of the plate off the wood.
You can easily test by just inserting the rod through the tie plate before final fitting, it'll grab nicely and you'll see what I mean.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 11 2020 at 6:08pm
Your local hobby shop will have brass rods of various thicknesses that you can use to replace the broken reinforcing pin in your rifle. Once you have removed the broken pin cut to length the new brass rod leaving 1/8" exposed on either side,lightly tap the new brass pin into place and then  tap the ends with a small brad pin hammer or rock hammer until you have peened the ends down.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fazak48 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 7:18am
Sorry if rude on intro. In "research/info" mode, lol. 


he!!o Folks and thanks for replies!


I'm a history grad and avid buff of all things military hailing from the Buffalo, NY area. Have a couple of "plinkers" and a wall-hanger 1863 Springfield (Civil War is a particular interest of mine). Several years ago I was GIVEN a no's matching Fazakerley no 4 mk 1. Been in the rack with periodic cleanings since then. Finally decided to do the homework and get it checked out. Clean sharp bore and even headspaces on original "0" bolt head. Gunsmithe was rather impressed. To ensure it's status as a "shooter", I stripped and cleaned it for cosmoline over several days and found some damage at the tie plate area.  Looks like FTR draw repairs ( dowled blocks) and everything fits TIGHT as it should with proper pressure at the bearing.. So now....how to fix it the RIGHT way. 


Has anyone ever used T-88 epoxy for repairs?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 8:02am
Brass brazing rod works too.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fazak48 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 9:23am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fazak48 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 9:38am
Here's the area and piece. I am figuring with the area/piece epoxied and the plate/pin back in place with all other surfaces intact it should be a good fix.  I'm doing another acetone soak of the end to try to leack any of the remaining cosmoline out and noted that while not often noted in other forums, some very high-end restorers have used the T-88 for far more complex repairs on valuable guns. While Cpt. Laidler may be languishing in a small room, he does appear to know his stuff and while not branding anything, recommends an aircraft grade epoxy and T-88 seems to fit the bill for use on oily woods (by nature) and less brittleness while being structural and having a high tensile and shear strength for stress areas like behind the draws.

Any feedback is greatly appreciated, and as mentioned, thanks for the replies to date. This is a labor of love of history to bring this piece back to fighting form and some fun in my old age putting holes in things.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fazak48 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 9:52am
Being an avid camper/canoer and at one point having worked in repair on cedar and canvas 16 footers I get the "tent pole" analogyWink! I use them  for setting up a tarp canopy at camp sites. Frequent Flier miles in the Adirondacks, Maine and areas of West/Central Pennsylvania among a number of other places.


Enough background Philtno? Or am I now guilty of TMI....chuckle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote philtno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 2:33pm
Originally posted by Fazak48 Fazak48 wrote:

Enough background Philtno? Or am I now guilty of TMI....chuckle.
Hahaha, no, that's brilliant!!Thumbs Up
Thanks and welcome again Wink
Cheers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Honkytonk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 2:51pm
Shamu... read my mind... braizing rods. I have used them for several Savage 99's and 30/30 repairs. As cross pins, once a hole is drilled thru the furniture, I leave the pin proud on one side so I will only have one end to dress. Of course, liberal amounts of epoxy is applied to the pin before tapping it in and excess is imediately wiped off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2020 at 7:32pm
no such thing as TMI unless you get into ex-wives and such , we are glad you have joined us and as you see there is much help to be had here , we all enjoy each others projects - vicariously - but no less the enjoyment as most of us have been doing the same for years, decades, a generation now , 

we can even commiserate on ex-wives now and again alltho most of us would never alienate the females here or want to relive the times so ....just loin in and enjoy , we are a jovial bunch in general , prone to off topic tangents , but much to be learned in both venues , 


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Thanks for the welcome Folks. 

A decent, helpful lot. Not neccessarily the case in other locations, particularly if you're a "newbie" .

Having posted shots of my project, what's the general opinion of my plan? I am also VERY keen to know if my cleanup is sufficient to allow for gluing. I have spent hours/days trying to de-oil and am concerned about the effects on the wood of repeated "baths" of solvents and rubs with a well-worn scotch-brite pad and toothbrush, combined with heat and would like to avoid further risk. As it is, I know some would take exception to the level I've cleaned it but based on a careful approach none of the markings are affected and even the "wear" areas where hands have repeatedly grasped it retain their patina. NO sandpaper has touched it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fazak48 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2020 at 5:21am
Hey Philtno...you live in one of the most beautiful places left on this poor orb. Having traveled quite a bit in my time, it's still on my bucket list. Came close in Australia as a teen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2020 at 8:55am
I usually use denatured alcohol for oil removal. It doesn't break down fibers like many harsher treatments will.
I'm also rapidly becoming a fan of "Gorilla Glue". Its water activated if you're unfamiliar with it, you just wipe the surfaces with a damp cleaning patch, q-tip or whatever & apply the glue clamp & wait. It does "foam" as it cures & so expands, just be there to trim of any that wells out of the join area before it sets rock hard!
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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