Battle Site
Printed From: Enfield-Rifles.com
Category: Enfields
Forum Name: Hunting with the .303 British cartridge.
Forum Description: Share your hunting stories with the rest of us.
URL: http://www.enfield-rifles.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=10096
Printed Date: March 26 2026 at 8:17pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.07 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Battle Site
Posted By: Honkytonk
Subject: Battle Site
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 9:44am
| Is the battle site on a No5 calibrated the same as a No4? I believe the No4 is 300 yards. Thanks! |
Replies:
Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 10:42am
Not an answer to your question but of interest ? SMLE TESTING For the SMLE All rifles were tested for accuracy by the Small Arms Inspection Department at 100ft, and 10% were also tested at 600 yds. All rifles were fired from a special mechanical rest, known as an Enfield Rest, and a special Telescope layer was used for laying an aim. The Enfield Rest was designed to simulate the conditions under which a rifle would be held when fired from the shoulder, and was provided with hand wheel adjustments for laying an aim. Trial shots were first fired and, if necessary the foresight was adjusted laterally, or replaced by one of a different height, until the shots on the target were within the required limits. Five rounds were then fired, and four of the five shots had to be contained in a rectangle 1 inch broad by 1½ in high. Rifle which failed this test were rejected. At 600 yds 10 shots were fired, nine of which had to fall within a 2 foot circle. No 4 RIFLE TESTING For the No 4 Rifle, the accuracy test was the same at 100ft ten per cent of all rifles were then fired at 200 yds when six of seven shots had to fall in a rectangle 6in x 6in , the point of mean impact having to be within 3 inches of the point of aim in any direction. Ten per cent of rifles fired at 200 yds were again fired at 600 yds when 6 out of seven shots had to be in a rectangle 18 inches x 18 inches the permissible deviation of point of mean impact being 9 inches up or down, or left or right. Two per cent of rifles were fired from the shoulder, ten rounds being fed into the magazine by charger and fired rapid to test “feeding up” and ejection. After these tests the barrel was inspected to ensure that there was no expansion in the bore or chamber and that it shaded correctly from end to end. (Was not bent) No 5 TESTING The firing test to which the No 5 rifle was subjected was the same as that for the No 4 at 100ft. It was not tested at 200 yds but 10 per cent were tested at 600 yards when the acceptance was ten out of ten shots contained in a rectangle 36 inches x 36 inches. Two per cent of the No 5 rifles were also submitted to the same functioning test as the No4 rifle. Throughout World War 2 much of the accuracy testing was done by women shooters who quickly became proficient at the job. To speed up the procedure, the telescope layer was dispensed with, and aim was taken in the normal way through the back sight. The .1 inch aperture in the back sight was too large for easily laying a correct aim at 100ft, and a small spring steel adaptor was used. |
Honkytonk wrote:Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 11:10am
Correct on both! Very interesting read... still wondering about my question.
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Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 11:33am
| The No5MkI micrometer sight and the No4MkI micrometer sight both have the main peep sight opened up to 0.192",which should indicate that both are set at 300 yards initially. The actual micrometer adjustment for the No5 is from 200 to 800 yards whereas the No4 is from to 200 to 1300 yards respectively. |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 4:55pm
| Thanks Goosic. Those numbers ring a bell from what I'd read hear before. |
Posted By: A square 10
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 9:17pm
| yup - they are different , much like the 2A & 2A1 , but those were re-calibration motivated for the 762 ammo , the no 5 i think was thought to be closer quarters , but im certain someone knows better than i on that detail , |
Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: November 07 2019 at 11:26pm
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HT, I when I read "Battle site" I thought we'd be talking about "The Somme"  ------------- It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice! |
Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 12:15am
Being pedantic - spelling is important. |
Posted By: britrifles
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 8:04am
| Sight radius is shorter on No. 5, so range index marks have to be closer together than on the No. 4 rifle. I think also the screw has a different pitch, not sure if it gives 1 MOA per click as does the Mk 1 rear sight on the No. 4 rifle. I think HT was asking about the elevation setting for the battle aperture when the sight is folded down. |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 9:08am
| You are correct, britrifles. I must have a weird head, or cheek weld differently than most. On all my Enfields I've sighted in (with just the folded down battle site) at 50 and even 100 yards, I can routinely lob them into a 6" pie plate. Am I abnormal or do any other members suffer from this ailment? I should mention at both distances, I aim the front post at the centre of the target. |
Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 9:36am
From an old post on another forum : Parashooter – No4 Vs No5 Rear sight Threads Given the slightly coarser thread on the 800-yard sight, the "click value" would be some 10% greater than the 1300-yard sight if both were mounted on rifles with the same sight radius - except for the fact that the 1300-yard elevation screw is double-threaded, giving it an effective pitch approximately double that of the single-thread 800-yard screw. On measuring the two sights shown, each click of the No.4's sight moves the slide .008" - vs. .0043" on the No.5's sight. Consequently, the 1300-yard sight gives very close to 1.0 MOA per click with the No.4 rifle's 28" sight radius while the 800-yard sight has a click value of ~0.66 MOA with the No.5's 23" sight radius and would yield ~0.55 MOA on a No.4 rifle. (Pretty much what Maxwell Smart reports in post #17 on this thread.) |
Posted By: britrifles
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 9:51am
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Yes, I recall this information. Made me think of getting a No. 5 rifle rear sight and install on my No. 4 to give a finer adjustment; but would not be considered "in the spirit" of the as issued Vintage service rifle matches. I did confirm that the Mk 1 rear sight for the No. 4 rifle does indeed give 1 MOA clicks on the No. 4 rifle; quite adequate for centering groups on the short range targets (to 300 yards).
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Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 10:37am
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Could you swap the threaded components from the No5 to the No4 rear sight? ------------- It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice! |
Posted By: britrifles
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 11:14am
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That's tempting! But, since I use this for service rifle matches, I wouldn't feel right about it. Honestly, even with the 1 MOA adjustable Mk 1 sight, it's not too difficult to get a clean score at 200 yards. When I want to shoot an open "unlimited" match, I put the PH 5C/D on and get 1/4 MOA windage and elevation.
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Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 11:27am
I just swapped out the complete sight on my No4 (but I don't shoot competitions) and bagged up (and labelled) the original sight so it can always remain with 'its' rifle. 1/2 MOA makes a big difference. |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 12:47pm
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The battle sight is 300 on both. Being a larger aperture its very sight positioning change is not relevant. It may be as simple as your FRONT sight being the wrong height? ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: November 08 2019 at 1:50pm
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