#4 build question
Printed From: Enfield-Rifles.com
Category: Enfields
Forum Name: Enfield Gunsmithing
Forum Description: Submit any how-to's or other gunsmithing suggestions here.
URL: http://www.enfield-rifles.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=6965
Printed Date: March 26 2026 at 6:30pm
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Topic: #4 build question
Posted By: Long branch
Subject: #4 build question
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 10:46am
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Some of you may have seen sarco advertising barrelled enfield receivers. The #4 receivers are $70. My plan is to get one, yank the old barrel out (make that sound easy, don't I?), and install a new criterion barrel. These receivers don't have bolts. I know I'll have to fit the locking lugs on the replacement bolt to engage properly. So, here's my question. I read somewhere that the #1 receivers were basically case hardened at the locking surfaces, so you can't just lap the lugs. Is that true of the #4s? I know someone is going to ask why I want to spend all that money and time. The answer is this. I can make sure everything is built nice and tight, and exactly the way I want it. Now, if I can find a bubbatized #4 with a bad bore that I can get cheap, I'll go that route. However, people are asking $300 and up for some rather poor specimens. |
Replies:
Posted By: White Rhino
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 10:53am
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Well if you do this, Keep us updated on here !!! I have a JC barreled action I would love to do some thing with !!!!! ------------- "White Rhino" "Everybody's got to believe in something. I believe I'll have another beer." --W. C. Fields |
Posted By: Long branch
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 11:11am
| JC? |
Posted By: Long branch
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 11:14am
| BTW, they also have some receivers that have been milled for 45/70, #1mk3, and ishapore 2a1. The 45/70 receivers are $50. |
Posted By: SW28fan
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 12:42pm
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I do not believe that the No 4 Bolt head were cased hardened. Though that is not that difficult a process. (Once you have done and have access to a heat treat oven) I suppose that the Criterion barrel will be short chambered to make head spacing easier. After my past dealing with Sarco (they Suck) I would advise caution I would not even think about the 45-70 actions modified by their trained chimps. ------------- Have a Nice Day If already having a nice day please disregard |
Posted By: Long branch
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 2:30pm
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I'm asking about the locking surfaces on the receivers. The lugs on the bolts were shaved with a special tool to get proper engagement on the #1s for that reason. Since headspace is on the rim, criterion could just go ahead and cut the chamber. You'd have to swap out bolt heads anyway to account for the rim thickness. |
Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 8:35pm
It would be nice if Criterion started making bolt heads too! especially number 3's please  I think you have to fit the bolt to the receiver and not the receiver to the bolt; as it's the receiver that is hardened I believe. ------------- It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice! |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 9:03pm
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I'd hear of the case hardening of the locking surfaces as well. I thought it was a universal practice, not limited to just the No1s though. I think "JC" is Jungle Carbine, aka a No5? ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Bear43
Date Posted: July 28 2014 at 10:08pm
| You don't mess with the receiver, only the lugs on the bolt body. I have seen it said before by Peter Laidler over on milsurps.com (he was an armourer for many years) that if there was setback of the areas on the receiver they would be condemned as they were then beyond repair, and that applies to all of them. |
Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 2:55am
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Agreed Bear; Peter Laidler's write up on the bolt set up is worth reading regularly! ------------- It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice! |
Posted By: Long branch
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 6:26am
| I wonder if that tool is available. As I understand it, the locking surfaces on the bolt are helical, so chucking the bolt in a lathe and turning the lugs down is out of the question. A milling machine could do it with the proper jig. |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 7:58am
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It's a pair of cams essentially. Its not exactly helical, but that is pretty close. The design came from back in the days if individual craftsmen doing hand work by feel & experience. The tool alone cant give the experience, lots of messed up bolt lugs did that back then. Engineer's blue (or a felt tip marker) & some judicious caution can work wonders though! ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Canuck
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 8:15am
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Does anyone have Laidler's write up concerning bolts? I have not read that yet. ------------- Castles made of sand slip into the sea.....eventually |
Posted By: White Rhino
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 8:38am
Jungle Carbine. ------------- "White Rhino" "Everybody's got to believe in something. I believe I'll have another beer." --W. C. Fields |
Long branch wrote:Posted By: Lithgow
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 9:30am
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The lug engagement was set up during proof firing. The firing of the heavy proof loads set the lugs back against their bearing surfaces, I have never heard of a special tool for the job. You may have to do some careful stoning of the lugs to get them to fit. Use bearing blue to check the fit and stone the high lug. |
Posted By: Jon287
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 2:40pm
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I would like to read this too, if it is online somewhere. ------------- Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their planet!! |
Posted By: Jon287
Date Posted: July 29 2014 at 8:11pm
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http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16948 http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16948" rel="nofollow - http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16948 ------------- Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their planet!! |
Posted By: Canuck
Date Posted: July 30 2014 at 1:33am
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Thank you for that link! ------------- Castles made of sand slip into the sea.....eventually |
Posted By: Long branch
Date Posted: July 30 2014 at 1:47am
| I've been reading through the stuff. I find the sniper setup fascinating. |