Newby to forum.
Printed From: Enfield-Rifles.com
Category: Enfields
Forum Name: Hunting with the .303 British cartridge.
Forum Description: Share your hunting stories with the rest of us.
URL: http://www.enfield-rifles.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7240
Printed Date: March 26 2026 at 8:19pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.07 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Newby to forum.
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Subject: Newby to forum.
Date Posted: December 25 2014 at 8:52pm
G'day guys, I'm new to the forum. I'm from Australia and hunt/reload with a SMLE No:I Mk:III and a Sako 75 in .270 Cal. The purists will probably crucify me but I have extensively sporterized/accurized the rifle and with handloads achieve sub 3/4 moa (best group=0.585" @ 100 yards, averaging 0.720" @ 100 yards). I prefer using the Enfield rather than the Sako (it groups even tighter....sub 1/2 moa) because all the work on the rifle was done by me (someone once told me "Ya can't get a .303 accurate"......well I just had to prove that wasn't the case) and it feels good using a rifle that you've put so much time and effort in to. This rifle is awesome on Deer (Reds, Sambar and Fallow) using Hornady 150gn.Interlocks but I'm struggling to make Speer 123gn.Hotcors (.310") group (best group=1.25" @100 yards). ADI Powders are what I use (my gun loves 48gn of AR 2209 driving the 150gn projie @ 2550fps....highly accurate and mild recoil). I have a great selection of powders to use (BM2, 2206H, 2208, 2209, 2213Sc and 2217), and was wondering if anyone has had any success with this projie (123gn.) ? 
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Replies:
Posted By: A square 10
Date Posted: December 26 2014 at 3:03pm
| welcome , show us some photos of your mkIII |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: December 26 2014 at 4:16pm
Here goes, I'm new to this so will see if it works ! I'm doing this on me phone.  Dammit, I'm trying everything and it ain't working....help. 
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Posted By: paddyofurniture
Date Posted: December 26 2014 at 5:29pm
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Welcome to the board. ------------- Always looking for military manuals, Dodge M37 items,books on Berlin Germany, old atlases ( before 1946) , military maps of Scotland. English and Canadian gun parts. |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: December 26 2014 at 5:39pm
Thanks to all for the "Welcome", I know how to send photos by email but can't get them to post on this....keeps saying the file's too big. 
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Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 6:14am
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There is a size limit if you upload to the storage area on here, but if you have pics on an online host like PhotoBucket you can just post links here. There's a sticky with the directions in the new guy info section. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: SW28fan
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 7:21am
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Welcome from texas ------------- Have a Nice Day If already having a nice day please disregard |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 7:24am
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Thanks guys. Trying to get these photos on the go.
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Posted By: Jon287
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 9:00am
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Welcome! ------------- Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their planet!! |
Posted By: 1952musso
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 1:15pm
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Hj there Lee Enfield welcome from Adelaide Australia I also like my lee Enfield rifles from 25 cal to 375 cal. regards musso ------------- musso |
Posted By: A square 10
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 5:44pm
| im not certain but there may be a minimum post clause as well , that said we are interested in seeing them - check the photo posting aids shamu has so graciously supplied |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: December 27 2014 at 6:09pm
    
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Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: December 28 2014 at 7:25am
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Nice set of rifles! I don't know of a min post count for pics, but its possible. There is a short "wait for approval" period for really new, new members to allow spammers to be ejected, but I don't eve see anything on pics specifically. Maybe Eric, or Tony would know.  ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Tony
Date Posted: December 28 2014 at 9:16am
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I THINK there is an approval time set to avoid spammers posting pics, It's a pain for genuine newbies but 1 spammer could cause chaos, bit like Hoadie with a hand grenade in a china store. The pics look great, I have a Parker Hale sporterised #4 very similar to your setup and 150 grain sierras with 38.4 grains of Vihtavuori behind them they crack out at 2752 fps and if I do my bit I can get 3/4 inch groups at 100 yards. Haven't had any roe or sika complain about the setup you hear the strike their legs kick out and over they go. ------------- Rottie (PitBulls dad.) “If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons Born free taxed to death!!! |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 01 2015 at 10:14pm
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Only 1 rifle (many photo angles) in pics, and you would be hard pressed to find another rifle like this, maybe similar but not the same. This rifle project took 12 months (working weekends on it when I wasn't hunting) to complete. All work was completed in my "shed" and a mates "shed" by me....no "Gunsmith" and no "Stock" maker was employed. The "stocks" are hand carved/crafted (Tazmanian Blackwood) sealed with "Tongue" oil and hand polished to a satin finish (glossy ain't no good fer huntin' lad) with a shotgun recoil pad fitted, action is trued + full length & pillar bedded, trigger is original but converted to single stage/ 3 pounds pull & zero creep, barrel is a generously "floated" 5 groove ("H" stamped) with a target crown & hand lap job (measures 0.312") with a custom made muzzle brake/weight (took 8 hours on the lathe - several models made and tested)....This alone reduced groups by nearly 50% but with a slight reduction in muzzle velocity. A "Bridge" scope mount was sourced and fitted after "Tig" welding, redrilling and tapping because old mounting holes were way out of alignment...A very crap scope mounting job was done before I acquired the rifle. Scope is a Tasco World Class soon to be replaced by either a Swarovski or Bushnell Elite 6500.
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Posted By: DairyFarmer
Date Posted: January 02 2015 at 7:46am
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Just noticed your rounds. Very far off the cannula. Either that or your rifle has a massive "jump". What OAL are you using? Have you measured your ogive length? At lease the rifle preforms better than certain rugby and cricket teams. Was thinking nothing good comes from the Antipodes. ------------- If farming was easy, then everyone one would do it. |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 02 2015 at 10:27pm
Yep, me rifle does have a bit of a "jump", the first round in the picture (which is 0.020" off the lands) is a Hornady 150gn Interlock flat base @ OAL=3.070", second round is a Hornady 123gn SST flat base @ OAL=3.060", third round is a Woodleigh 130gn Protected Point flat base @ OAL=3.040" and the fourth is a Speer 123gn SP flat base @ OAL=2.950". Both 123gn Projectiles are 0.310" and i don't seem to have any problems with accuracy from them as long as they are driven fairly hard. The seating depths might seem a bit slim but I do a lot of testing using different components and powder and I get great results with these combinations. All brass is fire formed PPU and CCI-200 primers have never failed me and are reliably consistent. These components and carefull/accurate reloading steps I think are what attribute to ES's and SD's in the very low double digits and even single digits, and if I do my part, give me shot to shot consistency which attributes to accuracy. The big bonus is all the loads have proven themselves on game out to 300+yards (a poor Crow copped a 123gn SST @ 420 yards...ranged !....ouch...just a puff off black feathers). All load testing is "Chronographed" and recorded. I use "Load from a Disc" all the time as well as "ADI" data and a few other paperback sources. I find a "good" ballistics App for the "Smartphone" handy too. The next test projectile/load testing, when the components come in (waiting...waiting...), are Barnes 108gn MPG (Multi Purpose Green) flat base projies and "Sabot" rounds which take 0.224" projies. If ys like I'll keep you posted. Some people must think I'm a bit "looney" (my "Misses" definitely does !) but I just love doing this sh!t and if I ain't huntin' or accurizing some blokes rifle and ammo what is a guy supposed to do ! (apart from maybe having some "liquid sustenance"....very important to one's self being).  
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Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 02 2015 at 10:38pm
I forgot to add I don't follow Rugby but I love me "AFL"...Ozzi Rules Football as we call it....."carn the Hawks" (you've got to be Australian to understand !). It ain't "Footy" season but Cricket will do. 
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Posted By: DairyFarmer
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 12:59am
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I see that the developer for load From A Disc has past away. I use PointBlank. Great program and it is portable. So put it on a stick or onto your GDrive and it is available anywhere. I am pedantic when it comes to my reloads. Each batch (even if components are the same) is recorded and given a number (i.e. 303_002_B). I colour code my primers too with permanent markers. Everything is added to PointBlank. Tragets and velocities (if recorded). I am slowly building up a record of every load I make. The graphs are very accurate. I normally use the 1st point blank distance to check groups and velocities. Then I use the second point blank range to check. Saves a lot of walking! By this time next year I hope to have a SuperChrono so I can check velocity at the second point blank range. ------------- If farming was easy, then everyone one would do it. |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 3:40am
Do yourself a favour, get a "chrony", a "Kestrel" hand held weather station and a spotting scope....you'll never look back. . It sounds like your as pedantic as I am. Nothing wrong with that, the more you can decrease your "variables", the more consistent your loads will be and your groups. This gives you confidence in your equipment and your ability. Regular practice usually achieves this and working up/ testing loads is a great way to do this  and it's fun. I'm a hunter (stalker actually....Game animals,not humans....generally ). Now I don't really need "sub 0.5 MOA or sub MOA groups to do this, but my close hunting buddies and I normally don't aim for the "Big bit"...As my mates son says :quote.."I'm going for the left eyebrow of the Mozzi sittin' on that Deer's neck"....The bugger 9 times out of 10 severes the spinal cord and bleeds the damn thing....oh how I wish I had young eyes again. I've spent a considerable amount of time and effort in accurizing there firearms and loads (they have a small arsenal....God help anybody that starts a war with them) and this result was achievable because all of the equipment above is used. They've seen the results and repeatedly can reproduce them....When they do miss a fox or deer or traveling salesman (only joking) there is none of this "IT MUST BE THE GUN", they know that they "STUFFED THE SHOT". 
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Posted By: daneko
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 11:35am
| would like to know where you may be getting the 224 sabots..that sounds like a lot of fun..... |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 12:14pm
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It's a bit of an experiment. A friend has ordered some with the seating tool "on-line". He's got a "Remington 7600" P/A rifle in 30-06 and pops 150gn pills out of it for Deer, he stumbled on to this website (sabotreloadingpro.com). He's anxious to try it...says the load data they suggest pushes a 0.224" 55gn pill @ 4200+fps. The sabots are for .308 Cal. but they might bump up and work in the .303. It's worth a try.
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Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 1:33pm
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There used to be a guy in "Shotgun News" selling sabots, loader & load data. I don't know if its him or he still does it, but it might be worth checking out. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: White Rhino
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 2:53pm
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I have always been interested in loading Sabots !!!! more info please !! ------------- "White Rhino" "Everybody's got to believe in something. I believe I'll have another beer." --W. C. Fields |
Posted By: paddyofurniture
Date Posted: January 03 2015 at 3:43pm
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What would you use for a bullet, a 223? UOTE=White Rhino] I have always been interested in loading Sabots !!!! more info please !! [/QUOTE] ------------- Always looking for military manuals, Dodge M37 items,books on Berlin Germany, old atlases ( before 1946) , military maps of Scotland. English and Canadian gun parts. |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: January 04 2015 at 5:58am
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I looked at it a while back. The thing is that Remington tried it with .308 & (I think) 30-06, the twist rates were supposedly all wrong for the .223 bullets so accuracy was iffy. Most .30's are 1: 10 or 1:12 but .223 is closer to 1:7. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 04 2015 at 2:57pm
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Thanks Shamu, I new someone must have "tinkered" with these things before and was wondering what sort of problems might crop up. The mate who's purchasing the "Sabots" is only getting a couple hundred and his words were "If it works...GREAT, if it doesn't...it doesn't. ". By the look of it the bigger "cals" don't have a fast enough " twist rate to stabilize the little .224" projectiles, he's got plenty on hand to play with....I think he said about 2000 of the 55gn and 600 of the 69gn. Ahh well, if nothin else at least we'll have a little fun playing around with'em. .I've got two more jobs to play around with after the this one.... 110 grainers in a 300 Winchester Magnum and "load" accuracy testing (3 different projectile combinations...240gn, 265gn and 300gn.) a 444 Marlin ! ( OUCH.. my shoulder ain't gunna like them two) and I think one of the "Deer Hunting Club" members wants me to sort out his 35 Whelen and 225gn loads. I must be a "glutton" for punishment....give me the ole .303 any day !
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Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: January 05 2015 at 5:08am
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I always wondered if there wasn't some kind of "sweet spot" for saboted loads. Some combination of weight twist & velocity that would overcome the basic limitation. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 05 2015 at 7:15am
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Well Shamu, when the "sabots" arrive I'll be dropping everything else so I can start "working" up a load. I'm hoping they'll be here before the weekend, but I ain't holding me breath (everything I've ordered lately must be getting delivered by a one legged snail on Vallium ). When I get a chance I'll fire up the computer and start working up some "theoreticals", that way I'll have some where to start. I'm sure my mate said something like.... "don't drive'em harder than 4200+fps, they'll just disintegrate as they leave the barrel"....but I reckon he was talking about these 40gn "varmint" projies he uses.
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Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: January 05 2015 at 8:29am
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Keep us posted, this might be interesting. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Lee Enfield
Date Posted: January 05 2015 at 3:12pm
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Hi Shamu, found this on the "Reloadingpro.com" website, I know it's for the 30-40 Krag but being the closest thing to .303 it will give me some where to start !... Kit includes 100 Sabots, The sabot seating die, and free reloading data. Reloading data Included* SKU X01-22 Price $23.90 Sale Price $19.95 Qty FREE SHIPPING on All orders of $50 or MORE * Please keep in mind that the data is for reference only * * Caution * case capacity calculations * ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Cartridge case capasity may vary 5-10% between brands. Cartridge Type - ..30-40 Krag Bullet Type - .22/sabot Bullet Weight - 55 Butllet Diameter (IN) - .308 Overall Cartridge Length (IN) - 2.8 Case Length (IN) - 2.304 Full Case Capacity (GR WATER) - 52.2 Bullet Length (IN) - .72 Barrel Length (IN) - 22 Bullet Seating Depth (IN) - .224 Displaced Water (GR) - 4.212 Effeective Water Capasity of Case (GR) - 47.998 Effective Barrel Length (IN) - 19.92 **1fd 1 Cartridge Load Development/** 4-26-93 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Cartridge Data - .30-40 Krag Caliber - .308 Bullet Weight - 55 GR Barrel Length - 19.92 in Case Capasity - 63.283 GR of Water (CALC) Bullet Dianeter - .308 Sectional Dencity - .083 Volume Ratio - 8.7 Cartridge Temperature - 70 Degrees F. Powder Class - FAST POWDERS Powder type - IMR-4198, RX7, S-4197 *Check Manual* Charge/ Bullet Weight - 0.698 Calc. Powdrer Charge - 38.4 GR Load Den - 80% Est. Muzzle Velocity - 3700 FT/SEC Est. Peak Pressure - 38500 PSI Powder Class - Alternate powder class not available. **For starting loads reduce Calc. powder charge by at least 10%** **Alternate load information** 04-23-93 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Cartridge Data - .30-40 Krag Powder type - IMR-4198, RX7, S-4197 *Check Manual* Load Dencity Charge Weight Velocity Pressure % GR FPS PSI 75 36.0 3500 33800 80 38.4 3700 38500 85 40.8 3900 43500 90 42.2 4200 48700* 95 45.6 4400 54300* 100 48.0 4600 60200* * Warning - HIGH PRESSURE - REFERENCE ONLY !
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Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: January 06 2015 at 4:51am
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Thanks. I looked in the latest SGN but didn't see the guy's ad. Maybe the next issue as some do on on one off advertising to save money. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |