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No1 Mk111 Lithgow update

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Topic: No1 Mk111 Lithgow update
Posted By: Honkytonk
Subject: No1 Mk111 Lithgow update
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 8:45am
Well. I finally got an e-mailed from the bloke who's building me my Lithgow. He said he was getting close, but as I had talked to him earlier in regards to a P-H peep site (which he didn't reply) I had given up on the peep. His e-mailed said he's been super busy, but was I still interested in that peep site? He said it's almost 100 years old, tip top shape and made for the No1. He also only has one, and it's stupid expensive. $350 CAD installed. He's supposed to send me some pics, but not holding my breath. I am curious if it's a similar model to Shamus very cool Steampunk site.



Replies:
Posted By: hoadie
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 9:00am
$ 350 CDN!? Holy snappin sheep Sh%t!! Thats xpensive!(then again...thats only $4.50 USD.)

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Loose wimmen tightened here


Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 9:37am
These are on eBay right now and this man is a trusted seller.


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 10:16am
The PH-5A is like the one I removed & sold to ZED. The one you show has no eyepiece.
They go for an average of $250 or so here so C$350 with the mount kit & installation (if it includes shimming) its a fair deal. Find out if its matching serial numbers (1 on the sight, the other on the mount)

The AGP 9G is very much like the one I have, except for the eyepiece which just screws in so you could change it out. I have the 6-hole eyepiece.
@ $160 its a good deal fer shure . . .
BUT!
It doesn't have the (rare) mount adapter needed to attach it to a SMLE!
Most come with mounts for the earlier "Long Lee's" (shown below, circled in red) & are not interchangeable.
You'd still need either this one (the close up model), or the longer "standard" one. You can tell them easily they have the dog leg hanging down. You'd also need a mounting kit. (3 screws a couple of springs & the big pivot bolt, plus the doughnut spring from the safety on the rifle). You're looking at a long(ish) search & about another $150 to have a complete unit.




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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 11:57am
He has that piece as well...


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 1:49pm
That's the one for the long lee, it won't fit a SMLE because of the different safeties.
He'd need the one I posted with the dogleg sticking down so it bolts to the rear trigger guard screw.





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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 1:57pm
I'll say it again. That is one cool site! Have you shot it yet?


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 2:06pm
Yes I got it to the range finally & got it zeroed.
I have to drift the front sight to the right a little because when you fold the sight arm it fouls the base of the cutout & wont allow it to fold fully. Right now I have to go 8 clicks RIGHT > to get it to fold. You can see how close to the bottom of the frame cut the silver-colored windage cylinder is.
I thought I'd posted something about it here but maybe not.Nope! Can't find anything.
OK
I rough sighted it over the (zeroed) original sights.
With the aperture sight it shot about 4" right & dead on vertically.
I backed off 14 clicks from my rough zero & it was dead on.
Unfortunately I need to readjust as I mentioned above so it'll fold fully without offsetting the windage.
Here's the 10 round group I fired@ 100yds.
This was with R1M3Z South African ball. My own 180 Gr handloads were centered but almost 8" high!






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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 6:46pm
Shamu. I'm curious. What powder charge did you use with your 180's? I was thinking of using 180's with 36 gr of H4895.


Posted By: pisco
Date Posted: August 09 2019 at 6:54pm
hi i have a bsa side plate if it is of any help


Posted By: Bear43
Date Posted: August 10 2019 at 4:00am
Uh, Shamu? How old is that ruler? JcPenney Life Insurance? They certainly sold everything back in the day. LOL


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 10 2019 at 7:54am
I honestly don't remember how old the ruler is!
The load was 38.5 Gr Varget, 180 Gr PPu Tula LR primers.


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 22 2019 at 8:38am
Latest update on my Lithgow build. The gentleman has beaded and painted the hardware, now fitting the furniture. He's installing the peep site. I confirmed it's a PH5a. He asked a weird question maybe someone here can help me with. He said with those sites that rifle would have been for target thooting. He said that being the case, he's gonna add some brass bits on the nose, trigger guard, etc. I'm assuming brass screws. Was this common practice with target rifle back then? Thanks!


Posted By: shiloh
Date Posted: August 22 2019 at 9:25am
Maybe he lost your screws and wants to replace them with non period correct bits.
Tell him to leave well enough alone.
The only brass
/bronze bits I`m aware of were some inner barrel bands.


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shoot em if you got em


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 22 2019 at 9:32am
He did mention that inner barrel band.


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 22 2019 at 12:10pm
Never heard of such a thing as tarting it up with brass doo dads, sorry.
If you're getting a PH5A here's something you'll like!
uploads/244/PH5A_new_ins_&_pic.pdf" rel="nofollow - uploads/244/PH5A_new_ins_&_pic.pdf
Click & print Wink


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Pukka Bundook
Date Posted: August 22 2019 at 9:09pm
Do you think he meant shims, H-T??


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 4:57am
I don't think so. He said cause the peep site itself has some brass on it that would look nice with his "bits and pieces." I'm sure he means screws...


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 7:38am
There's also "Brass" on the sight?
That's odd.


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 8:09am
Shamu. I'll write what he sent me via email. "Actually 5A specifically for No1 Mk3. I only have one!! and mostly brass fittings unique to a very few Lithgow's." So. That's all I know. Not being familiar with No1's or PH sites, I'm relying on more knowledgeable members. 


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 8:51am
Oh It's "Rare" alright!
Dead
In 50+ years of shooting much of it with Parker-Hale stuff, its the first time I've ever heard of such a thing. My best guess is he used some brass electrical fitting screws because many of them are still the old "BA" thread!
It would have that "Steampunk" look though, wouldn't it?
I started playing with Photoshop I'm so bored! At first it was just a gag, then it began to grow on me . . .
Whirrrrrr
Whirrrrr
whirrrrr
That's the sound of purists spinning in their graves.
Approve





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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 10:42am
That's why I rely on advise and knowledge from this forums collective experiences with Lee Enfields!


Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 10:43am
Originally posted by Honkytonk Honkytonk wrote:

Shamu. I'll write what he sent me via email. "Actually 5A specifically for No1 Mk3. I only have one!! and mostly brass fittings unique to a very few Lithgow's." So. That's all I know. Not being familiar with No1's or PH sites, I'm relying on more knowledgeable members. 


My No1 Mk3 has 'brass' on the PH5A sight.


https://postimg.cc/87yWH4KM" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 11:32am
Its a possibility! Not sure its "Mostly Brass fittings" though? Whats the brass on the rifle he refers to? "he's gonna add some brass bits on the nose, trigger guard, etc."

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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 11:45am
I can only guess it's a brass screw on the trigger guard where the site attaches. Maybe one on the nose cap and mid barrel band? He is a Brit and seems pretty knowledgeable. I'm just along for the ride!


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 12:28pm
The guy seems legit. I think he's a Brit. Funny accent, drinks Typhoo tea, calls me mate and says Cheers! a lot... Pretty much solid evidence right there!


Posted By: Moondog55
Date Posted: August 23 2019 at 4:29pm
I have a Lithgow Mk1 #3* here and it happens to have armourers pins through it in several places as the Coachwood stocks are prone to splitting, when I was shooting on the range I saw many with the added brass pins.
I'd post pictures but my longarms are in secure storage off-site while we build a new garage. They are tiny


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: August 24 2019 at 7:11am
Originally posted by Honkytonk Honkytonk wrote:

The guy seems legit. I think he's a Brit. Funny accent, drinks Typhoo tea, calls me mate and says Cheers! a lot... Pretty much solid evidence right there!

ConfusedBig smile


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: August 26 2019 at 4:16am
HT, if you want clarification, ask him what he's on about! Maybe ask for photos of the bit's too.
The only stupid question's are the ones you don't ask!


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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!


Posted By: hoadie
Date Posted: August 26 2019 at 4:52am
I wonder if these "brass do-dads" aren't manufactured aftermarket stuff?

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Loose wimmen tightened here


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: September 06 2019 at 10:26pm
I finally got some pictures of the rifle the gentleman in Saskatchewan is building me. The brass "bits" seem to be a screw on the nose cap and the middle barrel band. He says he just has to build and fit the bolt and finish a few other small details and should be ready next week!


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: September 07 2019 at 4:51am
"the truth is out there..." To coin a phrase from one of my favourite TV series. I've been doing some research in regards to the "brass band." I think I may be getting close. Please correct me at any time. What I've found is it appears exclusive to Australian No1 Lee Enfields. They were blackened for service. Not all were brass, most were steel. The brass  ones utilized prior to WW2? (Not 100% sure on that point.) So. As Stuart mentioned to me that since I requested the P-H site, he would add the "brass bits" to replicate a "target rifle". I now figure that means P-H peep sites weren't used in service and perhaps the competitors using these Lithgow's polished the black off the "brass bits" to pimp out their rifles at the shoots? I may be way, way off, but the research has been fun. Hopefully some other members can fill in the blanks. Thanks! 


Posted By: englishman_ca
Date Posted: September 07 2019 at 6:41am
Polished or not, the brass inner barrel band would be hidden under the wood.

Correct on the Ozzies using brass. I believe that some of the lower sling swivel brackets were also cast brass blackened. I have seen a brass lower outer band too.

This was a WWII expedient? Not sure why or what the story is, but some contractors were capable of casting brass, steel being more difficult?


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.
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Look to your front, mark your target when it comes!


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: September 07 2019 at 6:53am
Pics of the build.


The "inner band can't be seen its under the wood, look back at the schematic I posted earlier, its the bit the spring & bolt connects to under the noseacp.


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: September 07 2019 at 7:55am
Sorry. Meant the mid band that holds the top/bottom wood.


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: September 07 2019 at 7:56am
... where the front sling swivel is.


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: September 07 2019 at 4:11pm
No problem. Its a bit "Bling" for me but it goes with the hi gloss varnish.  As it's a target rifle I've seen stranger things done, believe me.
Heck I've done some of them.Censored


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: September 09 2019 at 10:46am
The rifle is done! No1 Mk111 Lithgow. Stuart is sending it out today so maybe by the end of the week! I'm real curious to see how it shoots, or better still, how I shoot through that 100 year old peep site!


Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: September 09 2019 at 11:45am
Excellent news; look forward to seeing the rifle and the results!

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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: September 09 2019 at 12:58pm
Here it is, I think I'm supposed to be posting this here for him.



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: September 09 2019 at 1:17pm
Thanks once again, Shamu. The fellow holding the rifle is the son and mentor of the gentleman who built the rifle. He said the rifles furniture is a closer match in real light. Apparently the butt stock, bolt and receiver are matching numbers and I suspect the rest of the wood was chosen out of his inventory. I'll see if I like the "bling" look. As far as pictures show, it's a screw on the nose, the mid sling swivel band, the ID disk and the inletted butt end sling swivel. We shall see...


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: September 09 2019 at 2:01pm
Any time, glad to help.
I sent you an e mail on this.
Wink



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 11:33am
I have asked Shamu, once again, to post some pictures of my Lithgow "brass bling" ( courtesy of my daughters new fancy phone/camera.) The gentleman who built the rifle said it was a thing some shooters did at the range years ago. I have know idea if true or even if I like it yet. Perhaps our ANZAC members can confirm? Thanks!


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 3:47pm
Just found them now. Give me a few minutes to post them.


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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 4:02pm
Not quite sure what happened some arrived inverted, so I put them right side up, then they somehow re inverted???




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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 4:03pm
#2



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 4:04pm
#3 it changed the order too!



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 4:05pm
#4



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 4:05pm
#4



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)


Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: November 23 2019 at 4:06pm
Final one



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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)



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