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Steve.AES View Drop Down
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    Posted: January 15 2023 at 5:20pm
Hi all new to this site 
I have a SMLE MKIV and was looking for any information on it.
The serial No is F19242 and from what I have found out about it so far is very limited and I think it was manufactured at ROF Maltby and other than that thats its can anyone on here help with any history of it?

TIA

Steve 
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The Armourer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Armourer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 17 2023 at 4:44am
Originally posted by Steve.AES Steve.AES wrote:

Hi all new to this site 
I have a SMLE MKIV and was looking for any information on it.
The serial No is F19242 and from what I have found out about it so far is very limited and I think it was manufactured at ROF Maltby and other than that thats its can anyone on here help with any history of it?

TIA

Steve 

Are you sure it is a SMLE MkIV - these are extremely rare. What calibre is it ?

Maltby never made the SMLE MKIV but they did manufacturer a Lee Enfield No4 Mk1 could it be that you have the 'MK' and the 'No' mixed up ?

Can you post some pictures ?


I suppose it could be a No2 MkIV, but that was a .22rf 'Training Rifle' - but - again non were manufactured by Maltby.



.22 SHORT RIFLE Mk IV
Approved 19th November 1921 (LoC 24909) for Land Service, this rifle starts out with a used SMLE Mk III or Mk III*
 but uses a solid, not tubed, barrel. Total number of conversions done by RSAF Enfield unknown.

RIFLE No.2 Mk IV*
Same rifle as above; just a change in nomenclature adopted in 1926. This rifle was the principal trainer for the next thirty years and was widely produced by in Britain, Australia and India. Issued in Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Ireland and India, a variety of issue and ownership marks can be found on these rifles. At least
30,000 conversions made by the various factories.




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A square 10 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 17 2023 at 7:33pm
please note that nomenclature here means a lot to us , i understand if your new WELCOME to our merry band , its a case of the no4 were never referred to as the SMLE , the no 1 rifles were the actual SMLEs , after that , and there is a difference were no4 or no5 etc , this is a picky side of our site yet we allow for all the sported riffles , its just that we purists are a bit more "picky" if you will , 

having said that , WELCOME AGAIN , we will help you with your questions , all of my serial number info now resides with bear here as i gave him all my data , i suspect he will be interested if this is a malby , i think he will chime in altho he is less requent here than he used to be , 

there is no animosity to anyone here , if you post photos we can help a lot more , our intent here is to be as helpful as losible - all of the info above is good but probably is not answering your original post question ,  
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britrifles View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2023 at 7:34am
Welcome Steve.AES, you have come to the right place.  I second the comments made by A square 10. 

I suggest posting some photo's of the entire rifle, and of the left side of the action body (receiver); that will tell us what your rifle is, where and when it was made.  It is most likely a No. 4, if it was indeed manufactured at Maltby. 

The most common "mistake" people make in Lee Enfield rifle nomenclature is to call the No. 4 rifle a "Mk IV or Mk 4".  For some people, the "mark" nomenclature of the LE seems impossible to shake off.

The Brits changed the small arms nomenclature in 1926 from "Mark" to "Number"; so the SMLE Mk III became the No. 1 rifle.  The new service rifle manufactured and issued during WWII was the No. 4, a variant of Lee Enfield that was built in the UK, Canada and the US.  The US did something similar when they changed to "Model" in the 1930's, the M1 Garand becoming the first rifle named under the new nomenclature.  

Design changes to the basic rifle "Number" were then identified as Marks (Mk).  The first No. 4 rifle was identified as the No. 4 Mk I.  Minor variations on that became the No. 4 Mk I*.  Then after WWII, the No. 4 Mk 2 with changes to how the trigger was attached was introduced.  Confusing?  

Why is this important?  Well, if someone wants to know all about their Mk IV rifle, we are going to give you the wrong information, we are talking about two very different rifles, the Mk IV vs No. 4.  The same goes for the No. 5 rifle; the Mk V is a very different rifle from the No. 5. 








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2023 at 11:51am
Maybe this will help.
These rifles are in original, as issued, condition with the exception of target model sights added later.
Many were modified to "sporter configuration" after the war so yours may, or may not look like this.

Rifle No1 MkIII* also known as the SMLE, or the ShtLE. Depending on which factory made it. All the same rifle though, just different naming conventions.


Rifle No4 Mk2 (or Mk1, or Mk1*), again minor differences, but essentially the same rifle.

Major difference to aid spotting variations.
Sights on barrel in front of action SMLE
Sights behind boll on top of receiver. Rifle No4

Muzzle flush with big cast metal nosecap SMLE
Muzzle sticks out about 1 1/2" from small sheet metal nosecap Rifle No4


Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Steve.AES View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve.AES Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2023 at 1:04pm
Sorry yes it is a no4 mk1
I will take some pictures and post later

TIA
Steve
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Steve.AES View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve.AES Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2023 at 1:58pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goosic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2023 at 8:16pm
Originally posted by Steve.AES Steve.AES wrote:

A very nice example of a 1942 Maltby made No4Mk1 that looks to have a new forend installed along with an aftermarket Parker Hale PH5C rear target sight, a Parker Hale King Screw and a Parker Hale front sight cover...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scottz63 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 1:07am
So, what is the purpose of the Parker Hale King Screw? It appears to be a third sling attachment point. Why is this needed and how is it to be used?

Thanks, Scott
14EH AIT Instructor-PATRIOT Fire Control Enhanced Operator/Maintainer
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britrifles View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 3:42am
It is used for the wide target sling, allowed in SR(b) matches. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scottz63 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 3:59am
Got it. Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 4:31am
Steve, this rifle was likely set up and used for Service Rifle competition, the reason for the PH 5c rear sight and Parker Hale trigger guard screw sling swivel.  This configuration was popular after WWII once No. 4 rifles became available up to the late 1960’s in the Commonwealth countries.  

The forend wood (which looks to be in very good condition) may have a barrel bearing (wood or composite) fitted which applies upward pressure to the barrel.  Is the barrel free to move in all directions at the muzzle? 

Are there any other markings on the receiver, such as “Parker Hale” or “Fulton Regulated”?  I don’t see the usual wood dowels used by Fulton at the back of the forend, so a previous owner may have installed the sight and swivel himself. 

If you’re lucky, it has a good 5 groove barrel that was cleaned regularly.  If so, the rifle should be a good shooter. 






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Zed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 11:28am
That looks like a very nice condition rifle. With the target sights is also a bonus!
Enjoy it! and please show us a range report when you get the chance.
It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 12:29pm
Yes, that rear sight is probably worth more than $250 by itself.  It has the 1/4 MOA elevation and windage adjustment knobs too.  Not sure if it has the adjustable 6 hole eyepiece, I don't recognize it.  
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Steve.AES View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve.AES Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 1:42pm
thanks for that info the rifle looks to be in mint condition considering its age with very few scuff marks and the rifling and barrel look like it's hardly been fired (but that's about to change) the fella that had it before me had it stored all through the eighties and nineties had a look at it in 2003 then put it back in his safe till he then decided to sell it and I snapped it up at 900 AUD my next question is, does anyone have any info on reloading as to keep costs down I am going down that route so any help would be good as a starting point for a ladder test and then seating depth. I can get 174gr .3115 projectiles which as I understand it is the optimum weight.

Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve.AES Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2023 at 1:43pm
It doesn't have to adjustable eye piece but good catch
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