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SMLE Front Sight Removal

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Overlord500 View Drop Down
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    Posted: March 08 2011 at 11:22am
Hi folks,
It's a pleasure to have found this forum.  I own 3 (4, if you count the US Model 1917) Enfield rifles.  A 1918 Enfield No. 1 III*, a 1943 No. 4 1/2., and a sporterized Lithgow 1942 No. 1 III*.  I'm in the process of restoring the Lithgow back to it's service appearance.  I only paid 90$ for it, including tax, so it was a great deal.  Nice bore, correct numbers, etc.

I've purchased the correct wooden parts and am assembling all of the missing screws, bands, etc.  My question is, to replace the "inner band" on the front of the rifle, it looks like I will need to remove the front sight.  How is this done?  In examining the sight, this wasn't clear to me.

Also, what are the "fore end stud" and "fore end spring" used for?  I can't find them on my complete SMLE and have no idea where they go.

If anyone out there has removed the front sight, please let me know how it's done.  Also any other expertise in restoring this rifle would be helpful.  Thanks.

David C.
in Vermont, USA.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lithgow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 08 2011 at 9:24pm
The sight is held on by a cross pin and has a small key to keep the sight straight.
drive the pin out and then tap the sight block forward using a block of wood and hammer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bear43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 08 2011 at 9:33pm

Since Lithgow helped you with the front sight, I will help with the fore-end stud and fore-end spring. Those pieces are very important. The stud and spring go into the fore-end. When the rifle is together the spring pushes against the nosecap and that in turn pushes the stud against the barrel providing the necessary upward pressure on the barrel. That pressure is important to accuracy. So, you need to get those parts and put them in.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overlord500 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2011 at 8:08am
Thanks so much guys, I will take a crack at this soon.  I received my inner band today, so getting that front sight off is now a priority.  I'll add those two parts to my list of "needed" items.  I've been whittling it down. 

You might end up hearing from me again.  This is a new challenge for me, but I'm having fun.

Thanks again.

David C.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lithgow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2011 at 4:09pm
I hope we do hear from you again.
Let us know how it all goes.
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Overlord500 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overlord500 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2011 at 8:08am
I will definitely keep posting here.  I'm sure I'll need advice on sighting the rifle back in, among other things.  Today, I took a little wood off the stock to fit the receiver and will need to take a little more off.  I'm hoping not to need to use any fiberglass epoxy to get it bedded.  The old stock I took off had been arsenal repaired with two brass pads - quite a bit of wood was removed where the trigger assembly/receiver fits into the stock.  I think I will list this wood on ebay in case anyone wants to "sporterize" their rifle without destroying their wood.  I also finished removing the last of the metal from it and fitting it into the new fore-stock - last piece was the front trigger guard screw sleeve.

I will post pictures of my other three Enfield's as well as this project gun.  I'm guessing that you folks consider the US Model 1917 and Enfield given the P-14...  Would you like me to post them? 

Also, is their a "gallery" section of this site, I haven't seen one yet.

Thanks again.

David C.
in VT, USA
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White Rhino View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote White Rhino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2011 at 8:12am
Post them with Your progress !!!  
"White Rhino"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2011 at 9:43am
You might want to think twice about that.
A lot of the Aussie coach wood stocks had those added as a protector for the shoulders, more were done by Fultons to regulate the rifles as match guns.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2011 at 11:06am
welcome - we need photos , we live vicariously here 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bear43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2011 at 10:32pm
Overlord, like Shamu said, those copper pads were used on Lithgows to reinforce the draws of the coachwood stocks. I would hold on to those. Now, one word of advice on doing the stocking up.... Make sure the draws on the receiver fit TIGHT on the fore-end. That is important. I would recommend looking at this as well, very informative on stocking up in case you are not well versed in it.... http://www.milsurps.com/content.php?r=307-Instructions-for-Armourers-1931-%28Part-2-Small-Arms%29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overlord500 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2011 at 9:44am
Thanks for all of the information.  Yeah, I saved the brass pads off the old fore-stock, including the mounting screws.  The new fore-stock has a lot more wood there - I only took off about a 1/16th of an inch and the for-stock still won't fit on fully - about 1/4 to go before it is in place.  However, I have only applied hand pressure, at this point, to press the fore-stock onto the barreled receiver.  Should I take a soft wooden block of pine? and try to tap the fore-stock onto the receiver?  the fit is tight only be the trigger assembly.  This is only the second stock I've fitted to a receiver so I'm still learning how to do this properly.  Obviously, I'd rather not have to take off more wood.  I'm attaching some pictures of the rifle, as is, and the stock.  You can see the lighter wood where I have taken that tiny amount off.  Any advice you can give, I'd appreciate it.

FYI, the "cut" in the picture look dramatic, but they are very minor.  They travel down at the same angle as the original factory cut.  However, as it appeared, that the metal was hitting only in the inner edges, I didn't take the full surface down as you can see in the picture.  Should I?  I tried to add arrows to show what I am curious about.  As I mentioned earlier, the original Lithgow stock had way more wood missing (1/4 inch, I'd say) and had the brass "pads" as well.

On another positive note, my rear sight protector and screw and nut arrived today.



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Sorry for the extra two picture doubles.

Also, the last picture shows how far the new fore-stock fits on.  Not too far to go.. I do wonder if gently tapping with a rubber hammer/soft wood buffer would be an idea?  However, I'm not sure if that would be too tight... if that's even possible.

The two shots below are of my three complete Enfields.

The US Model 1917 I bought at a car show (in the swap area) for $50.  It was sporterized, was missing many parts... They obviously had no idea what they had.  It's number serial number 5xx of the some 2 million that they made in the Eddystone factory.  Pretty nice find!  And, a fun restoration.

In getting the top wood for it, I didn't go crazy trying to stain or re-color it to match the stock - I figured it was best to leave it as it was.  Seems there's far more parts out there for this rifle right now than there was 7 years ago.

The middle rifle is a Mark 1 III* produced in 1918 by Enfield.  It shoots amazingly well - incredibly accurate!  My favorite, by far, to shoot of all my vintage military rifles (I have many non-Enfields as well).  I bought it, with a 1907 16" blade bayonet, for $199.00 at a gun shop.  No import marks on it, either.  A great deal.  This was in 2002, I believe. 

Reading the markings on it, it was used by the Australian Department of Defense during WW2.  It is stamped with a "R, MAU, 6/45" on the butt-stock, as well.  Not sure how it got to the US...

The top rifle is a 1943 No. 4 mk 1/2A - if I have this correct.  It was refinished after the war from a straight No. 4 mk 1 to the newer designation and then stored.  Bought this one for a little over $100.00 from J&G Sales out of Arizona.  Shoots nicely, too.  I've never gone through and "beautified" this rifle - it's still pretty dark from the chemicals it was stored in.  I'm sure J&G didnt' take much effort to really "clean" it, but that's a project for another year.  I have the spike bayonet for this one, of course.

All of the slings are authentic WW2 Production.

If you are curious, or want more pictures, let me know.

Thanks for the encouragement to share and for the advice, etc. 

David C.
in VT, USA



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2011 at 10:29am
those are great photos and thats some nice enfield stuff , thank you , and keep us up-to-date as you go , its looking terrific , what great fun these projects are

and i need to add that you have some very nice rifles there , congrats , i commend what you are doing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bear43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 12 2011 at 5:04am

If you have a rubber mallet, then try to tap the fore-end on. Be gentle. If you then look you will find that the tapping leaves witness marks on the wood and will show you were the metal is touching and where you need to relieve or leave it. Also, read the manual in the link I posted if you haven't done so. It is very informative as to where the metal should be touching and where it should not be. The key thing is to go slow and take your time. The fore-end should fit very tight on the receiver draws (the area you have chiseled a little) and at the front of the butt socket. You are doing good there, but you also need to check to see if the barrel is making contact in the channel. There are areas where the barrel should touch and where it should not. Again, the armourer's manual I posted the link to describes that in great detail.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cookie Monster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 12 2011 at 9:48am
Originally posted by White Rhino White Rhino wrote:

Post them with Your progress !!!  
 
Agreed Rhino
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