Enfield-Rifles.com Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Enfields > Enfield Bayonets
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - What is going on with this 1907 Australian
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

What is going on with this 1907 Australian

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
RichardSuhkoi View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: February 22 2021
Location: Montreal
Status: Offline
Points: 25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichardSuhkoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: What is going on with this 1907 Australian
    Posted: March 02 2021 at 12:50pm
Hi Everyone, 
I went to sell this Australian bayonet and when I look at the stamps I can’t make sense of this all. The cipher I’m sure is a GR, but the date stamp looks like 1917, then under the WILKINSON it looks like there was something lightly stamped. I see what might be a vise jaw mark? Wait, I just realized that sling George V is correct for 1917. So this leaves only the mystery illegible marks under Wilkinson and also if anyone recognizes the marks by the X. 
Another question is this came with a MANGROVITE 43 scabbard. How much of a mismatch is that considered? Is it legit to have a later scabbard? The blade appears that it never saw service and there’s no rifle number on it. 
No idea what the little marks are by the bend proof mark. 
So I throw the mystery out to the bayonet people. 
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
Zed View Drop Down
Special Member
Special Member
Avatar
Donating Member

Joined: May 01 2012
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 4416
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 11:42am
Wilkinson is a British manufacturer; not Australian. It was made in  November 1917. 
Adjacent to the X are inspection marks and the broad Arrow acceptance mark of the military.
I suspect it was refinished after WW1 due to the surface finish. Can't make out the partial stamp below Wilkinson. Unless someone has tried to efface the original manufacturer's name and re-stamp it. Not sure an FTR would bother with that.
I expect a more qualified member will maybe be able to offer more info.

Welcome to the forum!
It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
Back to Top
A square 10 View Drop Down
Special Member
Special Member

Donating Member

Joined: December 12 2006
Location: MN , USA
Status: Offline
Points: 11995
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 4:02pm
as stated british mfgr but may well have served in austrailia but i see nothing to indicate that , definite WWI bayo that was refurbed between the wars , as noted the finish tells us that as these were in the white when made , 
Back to Top
RichardSuhkoi View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: February 22 2021
Location: Montreal
Status: Offline
Points: 25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichardSuhkoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 4:43pm
Back to Top
RichardSuhkoi View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: February 22 2021
Location: Montreal
Status: Offline
Points: 25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichardSuhkoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 4:51pm
still struggling with photos but yes, this must be a refurbished bayonet.It has the WWII grips and the black wash I just learned was a standard finish for WWII. The blade is perfect including the edge, it has no rifle number, but has usage dings where the dovetail is.  My friend told me he is confident the light stamped letters at bottom are PALL MALL. 
This is bayonet CSI, I love it. 
Back to Top
smerdon42 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: February 20 2018
Location: Natick MA
Status: Offline
Points: 233
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smerdon42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 5:32pm
does it have an extra hole near the lug on the back if so it stayed with British forces they drillled an extra lube point in theirs the Aussies didn’t 
Back to Top
RichardSuhkoi View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: February 22 2021
Location: Montreal
Status: Offline
Points: 25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichardSuhkoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 8:13pm
it does have a hole. Mind you when I look at various Australian examples on eBay, some have holes, even a 1943. 
Not sure what that implies. 
Back to Top
A square 10 View Drop Down
Special Member
Special Member

Donating Member

Joined: December 12 2006
Location: MN , USA
Status: Offline
Points: 11995
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2021 at 9:07pm
FWIW , those slaz scales were extensively used in refurb , so that may account for it if refurbed in austrailia , they were readily available some time back as well , i actually bought a set a decade ago or so , could have been fitted to it at any time , 

 the mangrovite scabbard did not necessarily get assigned to that blade in service , they were assigned whatever was available in the supply chain at the time , also anyone might have paired these over the years , 

markings on the blade itself would be looked at differently tho , but again i see nothing there , save possible refinish [that the austrailians did do between the wars] to indicate use there , a military district mark , or an identifiable unit marking , is there anything on the hilt ?
but again , they did use most anything available at the time so who knows ? 
Back to Top
AussieShooter View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: April 14 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Status: Offline
Points: 154
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AussieShooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 28 2021 at 7:28pm
I want to pick up this thread and pursue the Mangrovite 43 stamps. I noticed many, many scabbards are dated ‘43 and I wonder if there is any evidence suggesting scabbards were “bulk manufactured” or at least disproportionately manufactured in 1943??  There seems to be a lot of them. 
"Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges" - Tacitus
The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates
Back to Top
Shamu View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar
Logo Designer / Donating Member

Joined: April 25 2007
Location: MD, USA.
Status: Offline
Points: 13755
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2021 at 8:42am
Mine has the hole, but I don't think its for lube! There's nothing there to lube its just a hole drilled all the way through?
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
Back to Top
Zed View Drop Down
Special Member
Special Member
Avatar
Donating Member

Joined: May 01 2012
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 4416
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2021 at 9:37am
the hole is to clean the dirt out of the lock.
It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
Back to Top
Shamu View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar
Logo Designer / Donating Member

Joined: April 25 2007
Location: MD, USA.
Status: Offline
Points: 13755
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2021 at 1:22pm
That's what I read. Makes far more sense as the hole goes past the front of the "track" where the bayonet lug slides in.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
Back to Top
A square 10 View Drop Down
Special Member
Special Member

Donating Member

Joined: December 12 2006
Location: MN , USA
Status: Offline
Points: 11995
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2021 at 6:49pm
yup a later model , the early ones didnt have that , 
Back to Top
devrep View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 28 2020
Location: florida
Status: Offline
Points: 625
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote devrep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 02 2021 at 1:48pm
I have 2 Australian 1907's.  neither have "Australia" stamped on the scales.  both have SLAZ on the scales as most I've seen photos have.
double gun
Back to Top
A square 10 View Drop Down
Special Member
Special Member

Donating Member

Joined: December 12 2006
Location: MN , USA
Status: Offline
Points: 11995
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 02 2021 at 7:31pm
i think you will find that most production was maximized in or about 43 , i think that accounts for the abundance of items dated 43 , just my opinion tho , 
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.