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Any new UK firearms restrictions?

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25-5 View Drop Down
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    Posted: October 26 2014 at 5:16pm
In light of the recent terrorist actions, have any additional restrictions been implemented or proposed on the legal firearms owners in the UK.  I have seen some onerous reports in a forum. 
Your losses are felt here with much anguish.  Mr. Vickers is a hero to us as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 26 2014 at 6:25pm
25-5: The incident was in Canada - Not the UK. Mr Vickers was an RCMP officer of 28 yrs, before he became Sgt at Arms in Canadian Federal Parliament.
As of yet, I have heard nothing of any further restrictions on firearms in Canada. The latest perp was prohibited from owning or possessing..so now they want to find out where he got it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 25-5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 26 2014 at 7:03pm
I apologize. I meant UK & Canada. Both had terrorist attacks. Most recent in Canada. We had a hatchet job terrorist in New York too. Only here the government calls it work place violence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Long branch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 26 2014 at 8:13pm
Originally posted by 25-5 25-5 wrote:

I apologize. I meant UK & Canada. Both had terrorist attacks. Most recent in Canada. We had a hatchet job terrorist in New York too. Only here the government calls it work place violence.


Yes of course, "move along citizen. Nothing you're allowed to see here."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tony Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 26 2014 at 11:35pm
They are proposing to have unanounced "visits" possibly to try and catch out people storing weapons and ammunition incorrectly. This has been slipped in under the guise of prevention of terrorism act. Totally unworkable due to loss of staff and firearms owners being out at work, so they'll have to ring and arrange a day and time to visit. Some feos try and interpret the guidance lines to suit themselves which just makes more work for them in the long run, they don't realise if we have good reason for wanting a wepon of a particular calibre ( say 222 or 223 for fox ) and good reason is given then it's a no brainer they can't refuse. I'm lucky I got hold of a Parker Hale  sporterised 303 some weeks ago I provided good reason and the turnround time was 3 days which is something of a record. But I do have a good working relationship with the firearms dept staff, they know me and my son and trust us to do the right thing.
Rottie (PitBulls dad.)


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 4:49am
Question for Tony.

When did home armory inspections end? I was surprised to hear that this was a new thing having been used to it 40 years ago!

I remember, under the old, Pre-Hungerford, rules signing away privacy rights to the firearms sergeant could spot-check your storage & ammo any time he wanted?
(Mine was cool with it though, always calling before he left the nick so I could "put the kettle on" & make sure to be there for the "surprise inspection") Wink

It was, of course, a different world back then & the police & shooters were on the best of terms.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DairyFarmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 7:44am
Anyone who doesn't take proper precautions in storing their firearms, ammo and reloading components should not be allowed to have them. Surprise inspections or no. Either it must be under your direct control or locked away.
 
How many times have you heard about little Johnny who shot his friend with his dad's gun he got from the cupboard. I feel nothing for people who are not taking precautions and may be slightly inconvenienced. They must be caught and pay the price. Its like going to the mall and leaving the keys in your ignition. Don't cry when the car is stolen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Long branch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 8:58am
The more I hear about these things, the more I love my state. We don't even register guns here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 9:05am
"Surprise inspections or no."

The problem there lies with the different privacy laws in South Africa, The U.K. & The U.S.A. There is a specific enumerated "Right" written into the U.S. constitution. (The Fourth Amendment guards against unreasonable searches and seizures, along with requiring any warrant to be judicially sanctioned and supported by probable cause.). I don't know if there is a similar law in South Africa, but I do know there isn't one in the U.K. The "Right to keep & bear arms" is also written in in detail in the U.S.A. as the Second Amendment.

There is also (in many states) a right to armed self defense, something very hard to do if the gun is dismantled stored locked & so is the ammunition!

In Britain it is a different situation as keeping an arm is a privelidge under British law , not a right. Those two variations in law make a huge difference!

I hear you about responsible safe storage, but it used to go way beyond that in the UK.
Back when I had a ticket there, in the 1970's, the rule was.

Gun stored in an approved locked container attached to "the fabric" of the building so it couldn't be carried off for later opening.

An essential part of the mechanism removed & stored in a separate, approved locked container attached to "the fabric" of the building. (Usually the bolt).

Ammunition stored in  a separate location (different room would do) in an approved, locked container attached to "the fabric" of the building from the firearm & its essential part.


In the U.K. individual rounds of ammunition were counted to a "to have" & a "to buy" limit.

Woe betide the numpty who made them the same if the firearms sergeant didn't explain to him that this meant you had to fire every bullet before you could go & buy more! A common request was "500 to buy & 550 to hold", that way you'd buy a brick when you got down to 50 rounds. Each purchase was recorded in your "ticket" (permit) a huge fold out thing covered in rubber stamps in a blue cardboard cover, that documented everything & you always had to have it with you. Even folded it was huge.

As an example I used .50 cal ammunition cans or 30 cal ammunition cans, locked with combination padlocks but bolted to the floorboards with carriage bolts (coach-bolts to our Brit friends) having the domed head only showing under the floorboards & with the nut & lock nut epoxied to the threads inside.Pig
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 25-5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 1:51pm
I knew you had more restrictive gun laws, but had no idea how intrusive they were.  An Italian friend has similar problems in Milan.
Thanks for the education.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 2:53pm
Remember this was 30+ years a go. I believe some of the rules have actually gotten less restrictive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DairyFarmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 27 2014 at 7:41pm
I look at it more like a traffic cop asking to see your license or do a vehicle inspection at the side of the road. I have no problem with it. The more they check, the more people who are not complying are caught. You should be welcoming more checks rather than putting up barriers between your self and the authorities. If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to worry about. As long as they are not picking on certain individuals for no reason.
 
My 9mm is always under my control and very rarely locked away, so it is ready to use. My other firearms, ammo, powder and primers are kept in safes as the law here requires (minimum - 3mm walls, 6mm door, internal lock mechanism, bolted to at least one appropriate surface).
 
In SA you are allowed to license upto four firearms of which only one may be licensed as a self defence firearm and may have 1kg powder, 200 primers and 200 rounds ammo per firearm. If you register as a dedicated sports person and/or dedicated hunter, you are allowed "unlimited" hunting and sports licensed firearms, but only one self defence firearm. Ammo, powder and primers are also "unlimited". Whether or not you can justify applying for the licenses is another story.
 
When purchasing ammo, powder or primers you have to sign the register. The police have access to that register.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 28 2014 at 2:42am
DairyFarmer;
In THEORY your right. If the programme is run the way it is proposed...but its not. I can't speak for elsewhere, but here in Canada we have no shortage of the police overstepping.
They "trump - up" the siezures, as well. If they make a large bust somewhere they like to do a news conference & display the weapons they have confiscated. Then, on the next bust - you see the same firearms (always mislabelled & mis quoted by media) - just in different positions.
They sieze at every opportunity. (Ft.McMurray flooding last year was a prime example).
If they gain access to your house for ANY reason - they go sniffing around for firearms..'cuz once their in-they don't need a warrant. Ie: they attend for a "domestic". While there they ALWAYS start sniffing around.(If the guy had a firearm out for cleaning & it hasn't been locked up yet, you lose!) Worse yet-all my ex has to do is tell the police that she isn't comfortable with me owning firearms any more, & they will be barging thru the door & taking them all. And that's without ANY threats & / or reason.
Any time the police get a bit of power, they exploit that to the maximum.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 28 2014 at 4:06am
In France the system is reasonably good; or at least I have not heard of anyone having problems with it. But this may vary from region to region. The Gendarmerie can inspect the installations etc, or as in my case they invite you to the office for a chat, basically to ask a few questions about what you have etc. Providing they see you shoot regularly then there's no real problem.
Personally I would welcome an inspection at least once, with the view to confirming the security of the safe's etc as all firearms are declared.
Ammunition allowance is 1000 rounds per firearm, with limit to purchase ready made to 1000 a year for large calibres, but reloading components are free. Just so long as you don't make up more than the allowance at any one time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 28 2014 at 4:59am
"In THEORY your right. If the programme is run the way it is proposed...but its not"
That is the big problem here in the U.S. The anti gun types are twisting & "repurposing" words & anything else they can to get ban outright ban.
Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DairyFarmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 28 2014 at 6:50pm
That is why we need to get as many people to legally and responsibly own firearms. Get it to the level of car ownership. The day powder trades on the stock exchange like crude oil is the day I can die in peace!
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