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I need some help with a Long Branch |
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A square 10
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Posted: April 09 2025 at 11:20am |
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Shamu
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Posted: April 09 2025 at 11:52am |
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There are
"fitting instructions for armourers (sp)" from back in the day that mention this. The Canadian manuals also detail the process. Let me dig through my manuals & see if I can copy/paste them.
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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Rossfield
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Joined: June 08 2024 Location: Nova Albion Status: Offline Points: 37 |
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Posted: April 09 2025 at 12:11pm |
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Good questions. The squareness check is the method Peter Laidler taught me and since he was a long-serving British armourer I take that to be the service method. The original factory process is one of those questions someone should have asked the people that worked there when they were still around to ask. I haven't noticed anything in the wartime films that suggests the methods used, but could be I just didn't notice when I saw those films.
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Shamu
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Posted: April 09 2025 at 2:53pm |
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Copied from elsewhere. I think this covers it in detail. "Notes from Peter Laidler (from 2007)
The notes primarily relate to the No4 rifle but the methods are specifications are the same. First things first. Bolts could only be fitted at Field and Base workshops because they were the only ones that had a 'GAUGE, Inspectors, Bolt'. This is a brand new, calibrated bolt. Still in white metal and marked as such. If my memory serves me right, the slot in the long/top locking lug is machined right through to identify it. So that's the reason if you have ever seen one. This bolt is bare. Clean the locking lug surfaces of the rifle and put a smear of 'engineers blue' marking dye onto the corresponding locking surfaces of the inspectors bolt. Insert this bolt RIGHT FORWARD, rotate it closed, then draw it backwards and forwards a couple of times to mark the mating locking surfaces of the rifle. Push it forwards, unlock and remove. Examine the locking surfaces of the rifle. The blue witness marks should be evident. This ensures that whatever wear that has taken place on the rifle locking surfaces has taken place equally. If its not, then I'm afraid that the rifle is unserviceable. BUT, that's not quite the end of the story because you won't have this 'Gauge, Inspectors, bolt' but it's only right that I tell you. Now for a little secret. If you have ever bought a rifle that has a sploge of red paint on the left side, adjacent to the internal left side locking lug, then you now know that the rifle was condemned for 'worn locking lugs'. If you are going to fit a second hand or new bolt, then do the same thing. If the dye pattern is one sided, then stone the high surface of the bolt until BOTH locking lugs bear evenly against the locking surfaces of the corresponding surfaces in the body. BUT DO NOT ATTEMPT to stone the rifle to get a bolt to fit (you can only get to the right hand surface in any case ....). The rifle body is induction hardened at these points to a depth of .004 - .006" but we have found it deeper. Now that you have got the bolt fitting, with the locking surface bearings matched, it's time to fit a bolt head. Any one will do. Screw it into the bare bolt and test the CHS against the .064" GO and .074" NO GO gauges. Disregard the numbers on the bolt head or treat them as a bit of a rough and ready guide but not as the bee all and end all of life as we know it! Once you have got a fitted bolt, with CHS, we'll come onto bolt head overturn. The bolt head should not overturn the long/top locking shoulder by more than 16 degrees but if you have a No4T or L42, it should not overturn buy more than a 'few' degrees. Mine were always 'in line' through selective fitting but you won't have a big tray of bolt heads to select from! The reason for this is because over a 'few' degrees (it doesn't define 'a few' but use 2 or 3 as your MAX), the recoil is taken on the bolt head and bolt threads. That is OK, but on an accurate No4T and L42, we want the recoil to be taken on the face of the bolt and transmitted radially, down through the bolt head and onto the front flat surface that mates up to the bolt head. Got it? Now we have a correctly fitted bolt AND bolt head AND CHS. That wasn't painful was it? During the week, we'll go into striker protrusion, bolthead lift and anything else. But before we do, I want you to get your strikers and roll them along a flat surface (overhang the collars of course) and sift out the bent ones because they're going to cause you trouble. It's always the 1/4" BSF threaded end that's bent and you can only TRULY straighten them if you have access to a lathe. |
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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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britrifles
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Joined: February 03 2018 Location: Georgia, USA Status: Offline Points: 8404 |
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Posted: April 09 2025 at 3:26pm |
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Thanks Shamu. Have you ever seen this in any actual technical orders/instructions to armorers?
I wonder if this was really done during wartime production, it takes quite a bit of hand work. On two of my No. 4 rifles that I checked for equal lug contact, both having the original bolts, both of them showed very little contact on the short lug. I wonder if that was intentional as this is the weaker lug. |
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NavyGeo
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Joined: February 22 2025 Location: Witch Wells AZ Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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Posted: April 25 2025 at 8:11am |
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he!!o everyone.
First, thank you all for providing suggestions, advice, and outright education. Second, I've been able to source everything this gun is missing with the exception of a magazine. The bolt is not Canadian, but it functions. I attempted to use wood filler on the 'practice checkering' areas of the stock; that didn't do much for the appearance. I'm reaching out to some leatherworkers on line in the hopes that one of them will make me a 'wrap' to cover up all that ugliness. I would rather do that then replace what I believe is a period-correct(if not outright original fit) stock. I'm also looking into finding some heavy duck canvas that I could use to make my own cover. Once I have this old Service Rifle back together I'll post some photographs in a new thread. Rick
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Shamu
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Posted: April 25 2025 at 12:13pm |
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I remember reading it in one of my old period original pamphlets. (I have a bunch of them as .PDFs) But I cant find which one. Was it done in service? No idea. If it was it would be a base workshop task I'd imagine though. If actually find the paragraph in the right pamphlet I'll post it.
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Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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