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SMLE WW1 bayonet

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hoadie View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 6:40pm
Holy Snappin Sheep Dip!! Terrylee do you have all those pointy bits?
Loose wimmen tightened here
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 7:18pm
ahhh , that brown bess has been illusive on my list as well as a nice lee metford and a long lee 22cal  trainer ,  along with the HAK no 2 revolver and some earlier ones ive been looking for , 

its always fun to talk about them and stir the pot , maybe ill get lucky and find the ones i want , 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote terrylee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2018 at 1:58am
Hoadie, yes, I do collect Pattern '07s by the maker. When a collector is involved in a field where there is virtually no physical difference from one example to another, it is necessary to find some distinguishing feature to maintain interest! Fortunately, where I come from there used to be a wide range available, and only two of the bayonets in the series had to be imported.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 23 2018 at 6:29pm
terrylee is a true blade collector , his items are excellent , if one was interested in a certain makers products i will always refer to him , and a couple others i know , but for us general collectors his insight to a certain item is most valuable as we only aquire 'one' of what we seek and there are so many available these days of the internet , 

he has depicted what i alluded to regarding the many makers , the production numbers might make some more desirable than others to a blade collector but for us that collect to match the rifles we own its really fun to get the input of the "one" we found , 

that is a great array of P1907s , 

i would love to find a nice VICKERS , and a .........oh well , we can dream , 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2018 at 1:18am
That is certainly a fantastic array of bayonets. Interesting that so many could be sourced in S. Africa.
I have probably not seen enough examples to know whether the one offered is of a good quality and price. I don't need it to be anything special (at the moment - like my Brown Bess with all matching parts) but if there is a modicum of additional interest with Chapman as the maker, then may be it is worth a punt.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote terrylee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2018 at 4:56am
Thanks for those kind words, A Square. Of course, whether they are justified is another matter!

One of the things I have noticed over the years concerning the maker-availability of '07s, irrespective of number produced, is that scarcity frequently depends upon where the collector is based. For example, the Vickers. While "rare" in most countries, I would judge as no more than "unusual" in South Africa. In fact, I cannot offhand think of any serious local collector who has not at least one in his collection. I here suspect that an early British shipment to South Africa may have coincided with a delivery by the Vickers Company.

Conversely, I had such difficulty in finding a "Smiling Tiger" and a 17" Ishapore locally that I resorted to importation. The relative ease of sourcing and reasonable prices charged was an eye-opener!

Ironically, amongst the rarest of the '07s in South Africa are now those are those which were locally produced during WW II by the Associated engineers Co. and the S.A. Railways. Although archival records indicate that 14,000 were ordered, they also show that the orders were cancelled due to the arrival of a shipment from Australia. Of the 2,450 completed I guess that the vast majority were later scrapped unissued due to their rough finish which compared to imports left much to be desired!   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2018 at 10:22am
I never ceased to be amazed by the knowledge of you chaps on these forums. I wish I had the dedication to do the research that is involved to find out the info you seem to have at your finger tips.
What are your thoughts on the fact the one I am looking at has had a sharpen in the past? I guess a squaddy may well just have sat there trying to put an edge on his bayonet. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote terrylee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2018 at 11:52am
Unfortunately, the sharpening of an '07 is most unlikely to have taken place during its service life and will certainly reduce its collectors' value. Under the circumstances I'd be inclined to give that Chapman a miss and as Zed suggested look out for a Snnderson or Wilkinson. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2018 at 8:34pm
i agree , as a colector it would detract enough to pass , but with the reservation that what little i saw did not detract that much from an accumulators point of view , it was not excessine in the photo to me , if its to be an accessory to the rifle without its own intrinsic value as a key element [as mine are] i would make an offer on it , 

both of those other options would be easy to find i think , but i would not get too hung up on the manufacturer as long as its dated correctly for your needs , 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 26 2018 at 11:56am
Maybe I shall see if there is any movement on price and take it from there. It isn't an essential item, but  if the price is right!! Whatever that is in the UK. Therein lies the problem....values.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 29 2018 at 11:54pm
I have found this chap who sells bayonets in the UK (coincidentally the same place I am getting my Skennerton book from) He has a couple of bayonets, all around the same price and less than the Chapman I was looking at. A thought occurred when reading a description of one of them. Should they have the quillon or not. It seems this particular one had it removed.
If anybody would be so kind as to take pass an experience eye over his wares, I may plumb for one, as they seem reasonable. I believe they would all be appropriate for an SMLE of 1915/16
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoadie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 30 2018 at 2:58am
I thought that the "quillion" was only found on Aussie bayos.

(I could be wrong, tho. Once before I thought I was wrong - but I was mistaken)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote terrylee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 30 2018 at 3:32am
The original design of the Pat.1907, irrespective of manufacturer, included the hooked quillon.  This was eliminated just before the First World War and most of the existing bayonets later had them removed when reconditioned. Surviving complete "Hookies" are worth a lot of money!

As mentioned earlier in this thread, the dates of an SMLE and its bayonet do not necessarily correspond.  On this basis any of Tenniswood's P.'07s would be suitable. However, if you are committed to matching dates, my first choice would be the 1915 Enfield - most particularly, if the SMLE itself was manufactured by Enfield, as could be the case.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 30 2018 at 4:21am
I have bought stuff from Mr Tenniswood's shop in Colchester.Althhough not recently.
He has some great stuff and is very helpful. Definitely knows his stuff!  I have not shopped on-line; but would expect the same service.
He has the Ian Skennerton books on the shelf too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sc-em Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 30 2018 at 9:19am
He has certainly been very quick to respond with queries over the Skennerton book, as he is down as the UK supplier on Skennerton's own site.
I will ask for some additional info about the 1915 Enfield.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 30 2018 at 8:11pm
the quillon was the original design - patterned after the japanese bayonets , it was discontinued before WWI and many were cut off to bring them to standard , while a very desireable bayonet to own [no they were not exclusively aussie , mine is a mole , british made, should be third from the left in my photo] they are very expensive if real and not neccessarily in the era you desire , there are lots of fakes out there and the prices are outrageous for a fake , a 1915 bayonet will not have a quillon , 
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